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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avacado View Post
    You are dumb as all hell.

    Let Papa Avacado educate you son:


    DEBT

    • Goverment debt is not like Household debt. The rate of interest of Treasury bonds is less than inflation. We pay back less than we borrow.
    • Most of the debt spike is from the cost of Afghanistan, Iraq, and the Bush Tax cuts. This isn't Obama's fault.
    • Social security would still be self-sustaining if various past presidents such as Bush jr hadn't raided the SS fund through the years.


    Taxes

    • The last time the income tax was this low was just before the great depression. Back in the 50s, the top marginal tax bracket was 90%+; now it is 33%
    • Despite the hooting and gibbering of the Right wing media, Obama hasn't raised taxes on you except for a few edge cases, like tanning salons.
    • The decrease in GDP from high taxes is much, much lower than the decrease in GDP from cutting government programs.
    • The super wealthy generally don't even pay what you and I pay as a percentage of income because they can hide it or use tax loopholes. They're not hurting.

    Short term thinker. Oh boy, like most people so I don't blame you

    Atm bonds are very low, but this is no reason to go all nuts on it. Eventually the time comes when we have to either pay the debt or make new debt. And Guess what those new bonds might be a lot more expensive for the state.

    Tax cuts are not a 100% loss in revenue. A lot of the money that otherwise is taxed gets invested or spend at a more efficient rate than the government can do. The wars were indeed a big burden on the debt, but the deficit somehow is still amazingly large in the USA and as you may have noticed we in Europe hardly spend a dime on wars and are also in large debts. Now imagine the USA with a large army trying to achieve the social state we have in Europe. It won't be a pretty sight.

    There is no thing as a self sustaining social security. It needs to evolve non-stop or else it'll go bankrupt.

    The great depression was the great depression because of too much government interference. That's why the last 4 years the economy is in the shitter too.

    If he wasn't halted by the republicans Obama would have raised taxes.

    High taxes will ruin a countries GDP in these modern times. Take a look at France. They implemented high taxes and soon after plummeted into a recession. Economic activity decreased insanely and tons of "rich" French people are moving out of the country.


    The super wealthy pay a lot less taxes because they get most income out of investments. If i buy stocks with my already taxed money i don't want to be taxed at the same rate because i'm taking a lot of risk with my investment that is a boost for the economy.



    Anyway, it's not that i want to remove taxes or lower them. I just find it annoying that many people seem to think everything can be solved with higher taxes.
    <Teth> It's best not to talk to Gunther, though
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    <@erik> Gunther will, true to his nature, probably get himself banned again soon enough ;)

  2. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gunther TheBlack View Post
    Short term thinker. Oh boy, like most people so I don't blame you

    Atm bonds are very low, but this is no reason to go all nuts on it. Eventually the time comes when we have to either pay the debt or make new debt. And Guess what those new bonds might be a lot more expensive for the state.
    We have no shortage of people willing to buy T-bills at the current rate, the only issue is dumbfuck Tea partiers refusing to let the goverment extend it's debt. (I don't agree that debt is good, or even neutral, just saying don't take a hatchet to education to solve a relative nonissue)

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunther TheBlack View Post
    Tax cuts are not a 100% loss in revenue. A lot of the money that otherwise is taxed gets invested or spend at a more efficient rate than the government can do. The wars were indeed a big burden on the debt, but the deficit somehow is still amazingly large in the USA and as you may have noticed we in Europe hardly spend a dime on wars and are also in large debts. Now imagine the USA with a large army trying to achieve the social state we have in Europe. It won't be a pretty sight.
    It's true that giving tax breaks to the rich puts money into the markets, yes.

    However giving tax breaks to the lower/middle classes also puts more money into the market. I prefer helping the lower/middle classes since their tax breaks also improve the quality of life a hell of a lot more than giving breaks to the rich. The middle/lower class tax breaks are also a hell of a lot more efficient for boosting GDP.

    Many European states are in debt because they don't control the Euro and can't do many of the things we can. Greece almost certainly overspent what it's government could pay, yes, but it's bigger issue is that Greece's version of the IRS is toothless. Rather than make the rich pay their debt to the society that produced the means for their wealth, they'd rather cut education and healthcare.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunther TheBlack View Post
    There is no thing as a self sustaining social security. It needs to evolve non-stop or else it'll go bankrupt.
    I agree with this, but only because restrictions on shit like capping payroll deductions to SS are making SS's income lower and lower as our GINI coefficient rises.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunther TheBlack View Post
    The great depression was the great depression because of too much government interference. That's why the last 4 years the economy is in the shitter too.
    This is hilariously wrong. The Federal reserve fucked up during the early decline that would become the great depression, but only because they did the opposite of what most Keynesian economists would have reccomended.

    Roosevelt's work programs and such (along with WW2 driving demand) pulled us out of the great depression a lot earlier than it would have taken to ride out the cycle naturally/

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunther TheBlack View Post
    High taxes will ruin a countries GDP in these modern times. Take a look at France. They implemented high taxes and soon after plummeted into a recession. Economic activity decreased insanely and tons of "rich" French people are moving out of the country.
    And America lowered taxes... and went into a recession. What's your point?


    Quote Originally Posted by Gunther TheBlack View Post
    The super wealthy pay a lot less taxes because they get most income out of investments. If i buy stocks with my already taxed money i don't want to be taxed at the same rate because i'm taking a lot of risk with my investment that is a boost for the economy.
    But if you're super wealthy, what the fuck is an extra million a year going to give you that you couldn't have anyway?
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  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avacado View Post
    You are dumb as all hell.

    Let Papa Avacado educate you son:


    DEBT

    • Goverment debt is not like Household debt. The rate of interest of Treasury bonds is less than inflation. We pay back less than we borrow.
    • Most of the debt spike is from the cost of Afghanistan, Iraq, and the Bush Tax cuts. This isn't Obama's fault.
    • Social security would still be self-sustaining if various past presidents such as Bush jr hadn't raided the SS fund through the years.


    Taxes

    • The last time the income tax was this low was just before the great depression. Back in the 50s, the top marginal tax bracket was 90%+; now it is 33%
    • Despite the hooting and gibbering of the Right wing media, Obama hasn't raised taxes on you except for a few edge cases, like tanning salons.
    • The decrease in GDP from high taxes is much, much lower than the decrease in GDP from cutting government programs.
    • The super wealthy generally don't even pay what you and I pay as a percentage of income because they can hide it or use tax loopholes. They're not hurting.

    The top 5% of Income earners in America pay 59% of the total income tax revenue of the US Government. 5%, pay 59%.
    The bottom 50% of Income earners in America pay 3% of the total income tax revenue.
    You're a fucking moron if you can't see the facts right from the IRS about how much is paid by the 'super wealthy'. I'm fine with fixing the tax code, but in most cases these people that avoid paying high taxes are doing so through their donations to charity. I'd rather these people choose who their donations go to rather than the government decide who it goes to.
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  4. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by xarnthal View Post
    The top 5% of Income earners in America pay 59% of the total income tax revenue of the US Government. 5%, pay 59%.
    The bottom 50% of Income earners in America pay 3% of the total income tax revenue.
    You're a fucking moron if you can't see the facts right from the IRS about how much is paid by the 'super wealthy'. I'm fine with fixing the tax code, but in most cases these people that avoid paying high taxes are doing so through their donations to charity. I'd rather these people choose who their donations go to rather than the government decide who it goes to.
    The Walmart heirs alone, put together, are worth more than the totality of the bottom 40% of Americans. No shit they should be paying more in taxes.

    http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2011/09/...mericas-gains/

    The top 5% took more than 81.7% of the total wealth of America in 2011. That 59% figure is actually really shitty with some additional context.
    Last edited by Avacado; 11-15-2012 at 01:35.
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  5. #50
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    http://www.theamericanconservative.c...ty-swing-vote/

    For all retarded liberals telling republicans what to do.

    edit: You didn't win that big to flap around about getting mandate and not seeing another republican win. You won two senate seats and some congressional seats and an election by couple of percentage points. Country is still divided. Republicans and Democrats still at each others throats. Boener wanted to compromise even before election.
    Last edited by Silverhandorder; 11-15-2012 at 01:35.
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    I should get ahead of the curve and ban you now then...

  6. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverhandorder View Post
    edit: You didn't win that big to flap around about getting mandate and not seeing another republican win. You won two senate seats and some congressional seats and an election by couple of percentage points. Country is still divided. Republicans and Democrats still at each others throats. Boener wanted to compromise even before election.
    Obama has the #1 and #2 records for most votes for a presidential candidate and won with a bigger margin than Bush did in either term.
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  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avacado View Post
    Obama has the #1 and #2 records for most votes for a presidential candidate and won with a bigger margin than Bush did in either term.
    Come talk to me when it's not 50/50
    "What, you think just because you need it means you have a right to take mine?"


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    Quote Originally Posted by Methuselah View Post
    I should get ahead of the curve and ban you now then...

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avacado View Post
    You are dumb as all hell.

    Let Papa Avacado educate you son:


    DEBT

    • Goverment debt is not like Household debt. The rate of interest of Treasury bonds is less than inflation. We pay back less than we borrow.
    • Most of the debt spike is from the cost of Afghanistan, Iraq, and the Bush Tax cuts. This isn't Obama's fault.
    • Social security would still be self-sustaining if various past presidents such as Bush jr hadn't raided the SS fund through the years.


    Taxes

    • The last time the income tax was this low was just before the great depression. Back in the 50s, the top marginal tax bracket was 90%+; now it is 33%
    • Despite the hooting and gibbering of the Right wing media, Obama hasn't raised taxes on you except for a few edge cases, like tanning salons.
    • The decrease in GDP from high taxes is much, much lower than the decrease in GDP from cutting government programs.
    • The super wealthy generally don't even pay what you and I pay as a percentage of income because they can hide it or use tax loopholes. They're not hurting.
    You'll realize, like I did, that shedding light in this dark room is as pointless as educating your redheaded stepchild.
    We should celebrate March 2013 as the month Off-Topic went Full Retard.

  9. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marilio View Post
    You'll realize, like I did, that shedding light in this dark room is as pointless as educating your redheaded stepchild.
    I'm an idealist. I'd like to think that maybe if I try, I can push a fact or two past their indoctrination and maybe bring them to reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Silverhandorder View Post
    Come talk to me when it's not 50/50
    You really are a petulant little shit aren't you?

    332/206 EV and a 3% PV difference is huge, especially with the billions of dollars of SuperPAC money that was spent in a vain attempt to win Romney the presidency right?

    Even Nixon only got 60% of the vote against Mcgovern, and that was considered the biggest blowout of modern history.


    Romney lost, The Republican senate lost members, and the House would be democrat if the 2012 house districts weren't gerrymandered to all hell in the Republican's favor. Get over it and enjoy our new socialist overlords.
    Last edited by Avacado; 11-15-2012 at 03:54.
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  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avacado View Post
    I'm an idealist. I'd like to think that maybe if I try, I can push a fact or two past their indoctrination and maybe bring them to reality.



    You really are a petulant little shit aren't you?

    332/206 EV and a 3% PV difference is huge, especially with the billions of dollars of SuperPAC money that was spent in a vain attempt to win Romney the presidency right?

    Even Nixon only got 60% of the vote against Mcgovern, and that was considered the biggest blowout of modern history.


    Romney lost, The Republican senate lost members, and the House would be democrat if the 2012 house districts weren't gerrymandered to all hell in the Republican's favor. Get over it and enjoy our new socialist overlords.
    Actually I don't give a shit who wins. The fact that you do shows you are a moron. You are like a party apparatchik in last days of soviet union.

    What retards like you view as a blow out in reality just means one guy has 50% of the country behind him and another guy having 50% of the country behind them. Shit is civil right now because neither guy is different.
    "What, you think just because you need it means you have a right to take mine?"


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    Quote Originally Posted by Methuselah View Post
    I should get ahead of the curve and ban you now then...

  11. #56

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    Remember you can not logic a person out of a position they didn't use logic to get to in the first place.

    Most Republicans vote against their own interest and they aren't doing that from logic.

    Just saying...
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  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverhandorder View Post
    Why not quote me on all the things I said that already came true? But sure go ahead I want to see you eat shit when it happens.
    12k posts? How much shit does one need to spew out of their mouth.
    Quote Originally Posted by dolic123 View Post
    This asshat LSPS (or whatever it is) has been posting.

    Guy needs to be banned ASAP.

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