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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Grixxitt View Post
    Critical thinking skills are usually part of higher learning.

    To be honest this entire discussion is moot until we learn exactly which classes they want to get rid of. When I think of critical thinking in a class curriculum I'm thinking higher math and science courses, troubleshooting, etc.
    Exactly. And when they are included at younger ages in association with current events or social issues as opposed black and white math, grammar, and science they lead to indoctrination, not critical thinking at all.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrBungle View Post
    If 3/4 of all the money spent on defense was diverted into education funds, public school would be dirt cheap
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Sparrow View Post
    99% of human resource offices are paid for by grants (non-tax dollars).

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by StainlessSteelRat View Post
    So b/c it has a nice shiny name like "Critical Thinking" you assume it's "good"?

    Have you ever audited a Critical Thinking class in a Texas public school?
    which focus on behavior modification and have the purpose of challenging the student’s fixed beliefs and undermining parental authority.
    If you read more than the first couple of words you get to this gem, which I find hilarious. It's pretty clear what this is all about let's not make a fuss where there need not be one. This is still Texas, this crazy shit still happens because we are literally run by the stupidest people the state could find.


    Quote Originally Posted by StainlessSteelRat View Post
    Exactly. And when they are included at younger ages in association with current events or social issues as opposed black and white math, grammar, and science they lead to indoctrination, not critical thinking at all.
    Yes, that's what's happening. The Texas GOP is AGAINST indoctrination because there are just so many damn liberals brainwashing children here... in TEXAS. Come on lol.
    Last edited by Apex Vertigo; 06-29-2012 at 01:37.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by StainlessSteelRat View Post
    Ever audited a DARE class or are you just talking out your ass?

    Do you have kids in school or are you just talking out your ass?
    Uhh I was in the DARE program in elementary school, so yes you could say I have 'audited' a DARE class. We had a school cop that would tell us all the horrible things drugs made you do or the horrible ways it made you feel then told us to 'just say no'. This is presenting facts from only one side of an issue and then dictating how to react to said issue. Absolutely zero critical thinking involved. This is indoctrination.

    Quote Originally Posted by StainlessSteelRat View Post
    Exactly. And when they are included at younger ages in association with current events or social issues as opposed black and white math, grammar, and science they lead to indoctrination, not critical thinking at all.
    I seriously don't you think you have any clue what critical thinking is. Critical thinking is a mental skill. It has nothing to do with social issues, science etc etc. One could say indoctrination is the antithesis of critical thinking. "the indoctrinated person is expected not to question or critically examine the doctrine they have learned"

    If someone tells you moses parted the sea, you can either believe what you are told or you can use critical thinking to analyze it and form your own conclusions about if this is to be believed or not. Bible thumpers do NOT want people to think like this, hence this opposition to the 'evil' critical thinking.

    Here are some definitions for you:

    Critical thinking is thinking that questions assumptions

    ...reasonable reflective thinking focused on deciding what to believe or do

    the intellectually disciplined process of actively and skillfully conceptualizing, applying, analyzing, synthesizing, and/or evaluating information gathered from, or generated by, observation, experience, reflection, reasoning, or communication, as a guide to belief and action

    the process of purposeful, self-regulatory judgment, which uses reasoned consideration to evidence, context, conceptualizations, methods, and criteria
    So you seem to be arguing that critical thinking in some circumstances can be bad as if it somehow leads to indoctrination. But the very nature of critical thinking is not partial to anything, its simply a mental skill/technique.
    -Kael Trighton-

  4. #19
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    People like these are why the Patriot Act got passed. Because they think it's patriotic due to the headline.
    Old UO RP'er who misses CoY and ERPA.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beeblebrox View Post
    Come on, mate, you'll have better luck converting people door to door. Our souls are already marching to the eternal fire, we are forever tainted by too much internet porn and grand theft auto.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kusghuul View Post
    People like these are why the Patriot Act got passed. Because they think it's patriotic due to the headline.
    Or my favorite: Citizens United. (legalizes unlimited corporate or foreign donations to political campaigns). It has nothing to do with citizens, or uniting, or empowering citizens. It actually is an unprecedented shift in power AWAY from regular citizens into the hands of big money special interest groups.

    A more accurate title would be "Fuck what you think, this is a full on plutocracy now".
    -Kael Trighton-

  6. #21

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    I'm happy teachers challenged my fixed beliefs, my parents taught me some wacky stuff.

    Edit

    Wow, this keeps getting better and better.

    "We oppose any sex education other than abstinence until marriage."
    Last edited by doomahx; 06-29-2012 at 02:40.

  7. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by doomahx View Post
    I'm happy teachers challenged my fixed beliefs, my parents taught me some wacky stuff.

    Edit

    Wow, this keeps getting better and better.

    "We oppose any sex education other than abstinence until marriage."
    Most teachers are liberal pieces of shit. The internet is a far better teacher than a government lacky.
    http://www.geckzilla.com/dfstuff/cannibal.png

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cannibal View Post
    Most teachers are liberal pieces of shit. The internet is a far better teacher than a government lacky.
    Really? I had plenty of conservative teachers. Their classes weren't nearly as fun.

  9. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by mcap View Post
    Really? I had plenty of conservative teachers. Their classes weren't nearly as fun.
    Using "conservative" with teaching isn't something I'd really do. Since that can also imply that they do things by the books.

    I had one right winged teacher, more of a libertarian I suppose, best class I attended in high school. Guy ran several local businesses, and taught an elective where he just gave lectures on whatever he felt like. Really smart guy, I believe he was the validictorian of whichever university he went to.
    http://www.geckzilla.com/dfstuff/cannibal.png

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nova88 View Post
    Uhh I was in the DARE program in elementary school, so yes you could say I have 'audited' a DARE class. We had a school cop that would tell us all the horrible things drugs made you do or the horrible ways it made you feel then told us to 'just say no'. This is presenting facts from only one side of an issue and then dictating how to react to said issue. Absolutely zero critical thinking involved. This is indoctrination.
    No shit, that's what I said. They justify the class by pretending it will inform and prepare the kids to make better decisions when faced w/ drugs, alcohol, etc. i.e. critical thinking (as they call it)

    Quote Originally Posted by Nova88 View Post
    I seriously don't you think you have any clue what critical thinking is. Critical thinking is a mental skill. It has nothing to do with social issues, science etc etc. One could say indoctrination is the antithesis of critical thinking. "the indoctrinated person is expected not to question or critically examine the doctrine they have learned"
    Again, no shit. That's what I said. Let me re-post for you:

    And when they are included at younger ages in association with current events or social issues as opposed (to) black and white math, grammar, and science they lead to indoctrination, not critical thinking at all.

    I bolded some important grammatical parts of that sentence to help guide you this time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nova88 View Post
    If someone tells you moses parted the sea, you can either believe what you are told or you can use critical thinking to analyze it and form your own conclusions about if this is to be believed or not. Bible thumpers do NOT want people to think like this, hence this opposition to the 'evil' critical thinking.
    Of course, it's bible thumpers..... It couldn't possibly be the fact that schools are attempting to usurp parental authority in favor of gov't authority to churn out mindless voters permanently attached to the gov't teat. Obviously, it worked on you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nova88 View Post
    So you seem to be arguing that critical thinking in some circumstances can be bad as if it somehow leads to indoctrination. But the very nature of critical thinking is not partial to anything, its simply a mental skill/technique.
    No, I said that they pretend to teach critical thinking when in fact they are indoctrinating. Are you fucking daft? I specifically stated that critical thinking is learned in the normal process of learning the 3 R's. Nowhere do I say that critical thinking is bad. They aren't actually teaching it is the problem and that's why parents want it out of the curriculum. It's smoke and mirrors nonsense.
    Last edited by StainlessSteelRat; 06-29-2012 at 14:14.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrBungle View Post
    If 3/4 of all the money spent on defense was diverted into education funds, public school would be dirt cheap
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Sparrow View Post
    99% of human resource offices are paid for by grants (non-tax dollars).

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makgyver View Post
    Texas GOP don't want your children to learn critical thinking. Are they serious with this? It does seem so since it's part of their 2012 platform. Keep your children stupid because that's the only way they will vote on the republican party.




    Link http://convention.texasgop.org/ , press "PDF Version" under "2012 Platform of the Republican Party of Texas" to view the document.
    As a guy hailing from the European education system, I can tell you "critical thinking" (at least how it was experienced by me in American universities) is a load of bollocks.
    You want critical thinking? Teach heavy Geometry and Calc classes with a bit of courses on theory of Logics mixed in. You keep it neutral from any touchy subjects (politics, religions etc.) while giving the powerful analysis skills to the student.

    Teach the kid the process of "P implies Q" and everything falls into place after that.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apex Vertigo View Post
    If you read more than the first couple of words you get to this gem, which I find hilarious. It's pretty clear what this is all about let's not make a fuss where there need not be one. This is still Texas, this crazy shit still happens because we are literally run by the stupidest people the state could find.
    Got any kids in school? I find it hilarious that you don't realize that school does just that. Probably did it to you. Tried to do it to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Apex Vertigo View Post
    Yes, that's what's happening. The Texas GOP is AGAINST indoctrination because there are just so many damn liberals brainwashing children here... in TEXAS. Come on lol.
    So parental indoctrination is bad but public school indoctrination by the gov't is OK........ I'll take the former any day.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrBungle View Post
    If 3/4 of all the money spent on defense was diverted into education funds, public school would be dirt cheap
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Sparrow View Post
    99% of human resource offices are paid for by grants (non-tax dollars).

  13. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by StainlessSteelRat View Post
    Got any kids in school? I find it hilarious that you don't realize that school does just that. Probably did it to you. Tried to do it to me.



    So parental indoctrination is bad but public school indoctrination by the gov't is OK........ I'll take the former any day.
    Wouldn't it be great if school had a specific class dedicated to challenging a child's upbringing and the beliefs parents instill, no matter which side of the isle they happen to be on. A class that encouraged children to debate their parents about religion, politics, sex and other social issues.
    Last edited by doomahx; 06-29-2012 at 14:38.

  14. #29
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    Here's a well made video that brings up reasons why critical thinking is important. I recommend you watch his other stuff too, he makes great vids.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OLPL5p0fMg


    Quote Originally Posted by Apex Vertigo View Post
    If you read more than the first couple of words you get to this gem, which I find hilarious.
    Crazy right? I find it quite baffling they'd actually write that and think it's OK

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by doomahx View Post
    Wouldn't it be great if school had a specific class dedicated to challenging a child's upbringing and the beliefs parents instill, no matter which side of the isle they happen to be on. A class that encouraged children to debate their parents about religion, politics, sex and other social issues.
    Yeah, that would be super! Course, they already do it a little bit here and there in every class.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrBungle View Post
    If 3/4 of all the money spent on defense was diverted into education funds, public school would be dirt cheap
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack_Sparrow View Post
    99% of human resource offices are paid for by grants (non-tax dollars).

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