Does Obama tak about this?

[Silverhandorder]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PIEGK0IbA4

Tell me if you can disagree with what is said here.

[Kekshorts]

bla rabble rabble rabble the antichrist rabble.

k, i'll post when i'm through.

[Apex Vertigo]

That music is really doing it for me.

The batman quote was a nice touch too.

[palo god]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PIEGK0IbA4

Tell me if you can disagree with what is said here.

Its a shame that the majority of people are too stupid to understand what’s going on.

[Kossako]

No offence but if Americans were living for money borrowed from rest of the world they should be punished. And this is happening now. Cause of trust rest of the world gave in American economy the world economy is collapsing. That mistake won't happen again.
I don't care about US , but they screwed European financial system cause our banks believed them and lend our money. You will be paying it back for generations.

[Kekshorts]

awe... I was hoping they'd end the first part with the asians eating the fat american after he became too obese to defend himself.

[Beeblebrox]

Could a precise summary of the video be: Ron Paul is a prophet and the FED is the devil?

[Kekshorts]

Could a precise summary of the video be: Ron Paul is a prophet and the FED is the devil?
yes

kinda funny how the people making these video's mock Obamessiah for his religious figure status.

[palo god]

Could a precise summary of the video be: Ron Paul is a prophet and the FED is the devil?

Here is a summary of the video. "wake the fuck up you blind fucking sheep the government is robbing you blind while raping you in the ass and striping away your rights".

[DocGonzo]

they palm the Ace about 8 minutes in..."they let them go out and leverage it up"

implying that somehow it's the Fed's responsibility, and not the criminals....for violating all kinds of things and over leveraging to 33 to 1, creating fraudulent "insurance" credit swaps and the other derivatives and the rest...

personal and corporate responsibility? nah...the Fed made us do it...that devil!

fucking spare me, please

there's a hell of a lot of good stuff in there, sound thinking and reasonable Policy ideas...but as soon as you go and let the criminals and gamblers in the Market off the hook for being Responsible for their own actions...you lose it with ethics, logic and reason....and me

[Silverhandorder]

they palm the Ace about 8 minutes in..."they let them go out and leverage it up"

implying that somehow it's the Fed's responsibility, and not the criminals....for violating all kinds of things and over leveraging to 33 to 1, creating fraudulent "insurance" credit swaps and the other derivatives and the rest...

personal and corporate responsibility? nah...the Fed made us do it...that devil!

fucking spare me, please

there's a hell of a lot of good stuff in there, sound thinking and reasonable Policy ideas...but as soon as you go and let the criminals and gamblers in the Market off the hook for being Responsible for their own actions...you lose it with ethics, logic and reason....and me

They suggested no such thing. It is fact that had not for FED's regulation of intrest rates those banks would not be able to do what they did. No one excused the banks for what they did. The blame is not solely with the banks.

[Lioness]

What's an economy?

[palo god]

What's an economy?

Its that thing that gets fucked by our government on a daily basis.

[Beeblebrox]

What's an economy?

Apparently, it involves complicated mathematics in order to prevent people from realizing they're being robbed by a small elite of politicians, bankers, investors and......the devil?

[Kekshorts]

Its that thing that gets fucked by our government on a daily basis.
now I understand all the spite and anger towards the government, you're just jealous it gets more action than you do.

[DocGonzo]

They suggested no such thing. It is fact that had not for FED's regulation of intrest rates those banks would not be able to do what they did. No one excused the banks for what they did. The blame is not solely with the banks.

watch from 7:56 on...Schiff completely blames the Fed for everything the "kindergardeners" have done... NO ONE forced the gamblers and criminals do over leverage...the Fed did NOT create credit swaps or a single derivative

the Fed did some wrong shit, but THEY DID NOT *force* anyone to commit crimes or violate banking/market ethics

individuals did, some using corps for tools and shielding...

so...while i agree there's a lot that needs to be done to fix fiscal policy, a solid monetary standard, abolishing the Fed and properly setting up the banking system...with the government being the ONLY one that can print money, not some private subcontracting entity, and assured criminal prosecutions for white collar crimes with sentences and penalties scaled to drug crimes...on and on

but i call bullshit on scapegoating and avoiding the responsibility where it squarely lands...the criminals who perpetrated the bullshit in violations of sound ethics

[Razel]

bla rabble rabble rabble the antichrist rabble.

k, i'll post when i'm through.

indeed, obama is just another corporate puppet and most of you are too dumb to realise it. This one in particular promotes 'change' when in fact he was chosen by the 'establishment' to keep things business as usual.

[Silverhandorder]

He is not trying to excuse the banks. He is saying it is not possible to do fraud on such level and grow so ginormous of a pyramid unless you have artificially low rate.

[Beeblebrox]

What about that fractionary system it uses for creating money? Isn't it like a recipe for disaster or am I missing something?

[Razel]

What about that fractionary system it uses for creating money? Isn't it like a recipe for disaster or am I missing something?

yup so without 'changing' the problem its business as usual.

[DocGonzo]

He is not trying to excuse the banks. He is saying it is not possible to do fraud on such level and grow so ginormous of a pyramid unless you have artificially low rate.

and you can't rob a liquor store without a gun...

so do cheap guns mean it is ok to rob liquor stores?

libertarianism only works with absolute recognition of personal Responsibility, until you comprehend the actual Ethic involved, i can't help you.....

oh....wait....that's right, you think it's ok to lie and defraud folks of money, then brag about it!

carry on...you should have sold derivatives

[Skiffs]

Thats why DF is going to be released in Europe first, They know that the north american community are going to be broke bastards who can't pay for anything.

[Ignotis]

Wall streets fault, not the governments. However, the governments response to this situation is beyond stupid. If this was a true Laissez faire government, we would let the banks fold over and let this capitalistic dog eat dog world resume without federal intervention. However, both dems and republicans are supporting these bailouts.

[cosimo84]

Interesting video but it's easy to make anyone look like a hero, and so what is the video trying to do? I've liked Ron Paul for a few simple reasons that I'm aware of.

-I'm very laissez faire
-he wants to give more power to the states and less to the federal govt
-i think being a "good speaker" is about as important as which color tie he wears because it's the same fuckn thing. I didn't like RP when i first saw him speak which was before I read what he was about. Honesty is stupidity when your reputation matters and you speak on TV. So let's get a stupid public speaker that we don't trust and have to find out the information for ourselves.

... Cause of trust rest of the world gave in American economy the world economy is collapsing. That mistake won't happen again.
I don't care about US , but they screwed European financial system cause our banks believed them and lend our money. You will be paying it back for generations.

Yeah that's how it all went. Countries lend money to other countries out of the goodness of their hearts. There was no transaction or vested interest present.

If you're going to "punish america" then make sure you
A. Only punish the people who you loaned the money to
B. Make sure you're God and that you have the right to punish the wicked and all that

[PirateGlen]

and you can't rob a liquor store without a gun...

so do cheap guns mean it is ok to rob liquor stores?

libertarianism only works with absolute recognition of personal Responsibility, until you comprehend the actual Ethic involved, i can't help you.....

oh....wait....that's right, you think it's ok to lie and defraud folks of money, then brag about it!

carry on...you should have sold derivatives

I can defraud people of money if they are also frauds in my mind's courtroom, right?

[Silverhandorder]

and you can't rob a liquor store without a gun...

so do cheap guns mean it is ok to rob liquor stores?

libertarianism only works with absolute recognition of personal Responsibility, until you comprehend the actual Ethic involved, i can't help you.....

oh....wait....that's right, you think it's ok to lie and defraud folks of money, then brag about it!

carry on...you should have sold derivatives

I said no such thing. I said that the cause of the problem is the FED and government regulation. Did I say that it was ok? No I said it was not and they should fail. However we should recognize our mistakes and fix them. Starting with taking out the things that were the main cause of the problem.

[DocGonzo]

I can defraud people of money if they are also frauds in my mind's courtroom, right?

wtf?

it's almost funny...but i feel like i missed something...oh yeah, the funny part

[PirateGlen]

wtf?

it's almost funny...but i feel like i missed something...oh yeah, the funny part

I guess you're forgetting his rational for defrauding the DNC. :rolleyes:

[DocGonzo]

I guess you're forgetting his rational for defrauding the DNC. :rolleyes:

i mentioned it earlier...

sorry i just missed what you were doing there, my bad

[cosimo84]

I guess you're forgetting his rational for defrauding the DNC. :rolleyes:

i like your sig

[DocGonzo]

i like your sig

SB spam sig 4tw!

[Thee Leprechaun]

The reason Obama does not talk about this is because this shit has already happened, so instead of talking about it he is talking about how he will try and rescue us from what has happened. Ron Paul has a good and respectable opinion on the matter but because of his opinion on pretty much everything else I doubt he would have made a good president.

[PainlessDeath]

The Institutions are broken. It's not one persons fault. It's not one particular institution that is to blame. It has been a long time coming, growing bit by bit until we arrive at what we are confronted with now.

The people aren't stupid. They just don't have any control over their government. All the potential solutions default back to that lack of control.

Apparently there is another round of foreclosures coming that will be at least as big as the recession caused by the sub-prime market.

[Silverhandorder]

The reason Obama does not talk about this is because this shit has already happened, so instead of talking about it he is talking about how he will try and rescue us from what has happened. Ron Paul has a good and respectable opinion on the matter but because of his opinion on pretty much everything else I doubt he would have made a good president.
If you support his position on the economy the rest of his positions fall in line with democrats.

The people aren't stupid. They just don't have any control over their government. All the potential solutions default back to that lack of control.


Lack of control? Do you know what allowed them to do such schemes? The artificial interest rates. Whats more scary is that this is the only reason why investment flowed into real estate.

[cosimo84]

SB spam sig 4tw!

stop repeating me doppleganger!

[Sabbathius]

I loved the presentation, the music. As for the rest, it is simply the case of "Lo and behold, someone accidentally guessed something right". Is it true? Yes. But it could have just as easily been delayed another decade, and then everyone would be saying how wrong the guy was. It's true, but it's too late now, so we need to stop saying "I told you so." and get in gear.

[cosimo84]

I loved the presentation, the music. As for the rest, it is simply the case of "Lo and behold, someone accidentally guessed something right". Is it true? Yes. But it could have just as easily been delayed another decade, and then everyone would be saying how wrong the guy was. It's true, but it's too late now, so we need to stop saying "I told you so." and get in gear.

yeah. Looks like another video trying to fool people into placing blind hope in a politician rather than really educate anyone.

[PainlessDeath]

Lack of control? Do you know what allowed them to do such schemes? The artificial interest rates. Whats more scary is that this is the only reason why investment flowed into real estate.
That isn't what I was talking about. (and it would be more accurate to say; this is one of the reasons investments flowed into real estate: if only because investing in real estate is, by and large, very profitable. But I get your point.)

My point about "people" is that it would seem to be an error to assume that just because nothing is "being done" that the people must be stupid, if they weren't, things would "get done". I posit that people have lost control of the government, therefore they are incapable of getting anything done even if they have the will to do "it".

[Silverhandorder]

That isn't what I was talking about. (and it would be more accurate to say; this is one of the reasons investments flowed into real estate: if only because investing in real estate is, by and large, very profitable. But I get your point.)

My point about "people" is that it would seem to be an error to assume that just because nothing is "being done" that the people must be stupid, if they weren't, things would "get done". I posit that people have lost control of the government, therefore they are incapable of getting anything done even if they have the will to do "it".

Oh I get it now, I had a knee jerk to the less control bit. I pretty much agree on your conclusion then. People just not holding the politicians responsible. 95% got re-elected.

yeah. Looks like another video trying to fool people into placing blind hope in a politician rather than really educate anyone.

I don't think you are familiar with Paul then. He is the only politicians that actually teaches you.

[PirateGlen]

SB spam sig 4tw!

Not just spam. It tells a story... A tale of love and regret. The love of killing, and the regret of indulgence. The tale of WhyskeyWylde, a tale that began with ragelogs and ended with /ignores.

[Tongue]

I think we are finally starting to realize that our Government is as corrupt as any other.

More and more control is rested on the corporate behemoths that caused this financial melt down. Is it no wonder why the Governments answer to the solution was to give more money to they guys that fucked us over? At the same time ensuring the bankruptcy of public funds, and ensuring that we will beholden to our corporate overlords in the future. These guys knew they were too big to fail, and now they are cashing in.

There really is no hope in either the republican or democratic parties, and Obama is a tool to placate the masses. Pretty dreary stuff...

[cosimo84]

Not just spam. It tells a story... A tale of love and regret. The love of killing, and the regret of indulgence. The tale of WhyskeyWylde, a tale that began with ragelogs and ended with /ignores.

sounds like a story full of love, loss, and lulz

[Paralda]

All I hear: "Blah blah blah I'm a big boy who can take care of myself blah blah blah I don't understand what the government actually does blah blah blah I'm going to blame it for my own personal failures blah blah blah I'm a libertarian blah blah blah people need to stop worshipping political figures like Obama as if they were religious figures blah blah blah OMG I LOVE RON PAUL HE'S THE GREATEST ALL OTHERS CAN SUCK MY COCK".

[Largion]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PIEGK0IbA4

Tell me if you can disagree with what is said here.

I love it! ;)

[Silverhandorder]

All I hear: "Blah blah blah I'm a big boy who can take care of myself blah blah blah I don't understand what the government actually does blah blah blah I'm going to blame it for my own personal failures blah blah blah I'm a libertarian blah blah blah people need to stop worshipping political figures like Obama as if they were religious figures blah blah blah OMG I LOVE RON PAUL HE'S THE GREATEST ALL OTHERS CAN SUCK MY COCK".

It was good when we had quality pinkos in here who actually criticized you and your posts for their real flaws. They are all largely libertarian now tho :).

So why don't you disagree with what they say by you know bringing in some proof to what you say? I think they know far more about government then you. Unlike you and your failsauce ideology they called exactly what will happen and were right. On the other hand people on your side of the fence were all jumping and screaming it will never happen. Now the people who were jumping and screaming promising no such thing will happen are tasked to fix our mess?

You guys keep saying he does not know how to fix these solutions and that he does not know how government runs but all his stances so far were 100% against what the government is doing right now. So do you agree then with what is happening? Do you agree with monster bailouts for banks and anyone who can buy out the politicians?

[holychicken]

No offence but if Americans were living for money borrowed from rest of the world they should be punished. And this is happening now. Cause of trust rest of the world gave in American economy the world economy is collapsing. That mistake won't happen again.
I don't care about US , but they screwed European financial system cause our banks believed them and lend our money. You will be paying it back for generations.
Give it a rest.

Europe is in the same shit as the US because their financial institutions took advantage of the same shit the US ones did.

[hardboiled]

That video is hilarious. I love melodrama.

[Silverhandorder]

That video is hilarious. I love melodrama.

Where you live? People around me are already feeling the recession.

[hardboiled]

Where you live? People around me are already feeling the recession.

Finland, but even if they do, that video is still pretty melodramatic. Not that I'm complaining, like I said, I love melodrama, it's the most I can possibly expect from a youtube video.

[Silverhandorder]

Finland, but even if they do, that video is still pretty melodramatic. Not that I'm complaining, like I said, I love melodrama, it's the most I can possibly expect from a youtube video.

Melodrama makes it sound like it is an exaggeration.

[Killuminati]

What about that fractionary system it uses for creating money? Isn't it like a recipe for disaster or am I missing something?

Pyramid scheme is a scheme

[Silverhandorder]

ARGH!!! I just noticed I misspelled the damn title. The hell man it always happens.

[StainlessSteelRat]

they palm the Ace about 8 minutes in..."they let them go out and leverage it up"

implying that somehow it's the Fed's responsibility, and not the criminals....for violating all kinds of things and over leveraging to 33 to 1, creating fraudulent "insurance" credit swaps and the other derivatives and the rest...

personal and corporate responsibility? nah...the Fed made us do it...that devil!

fucking spare me, please

there's a hell of a lot of good stuff in there, sound thinking and reasonable Policy ideas...but as soon as you go and let the criminals and gamblers in the Market off the hook for being Responsible for their own actions...you lose it with ethics, logic and reason....and me

Easy there big fella; no one is letting the gamblers off the hook from that side of the policy isle. To fix the problem, however, requires us to cut off the source of their gambling wealth. People will always be people; good and bad, greedy and generous, and all that shit. To fix the system, you must start at the source: the Fed.

@Hardboiled - melodrama?

mel⋅o⋅dra⋅ma   /ˈmɛləˌdrɑmə, -ˌdræmə/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [mel-uh-drah-muh, -dram-uh] Show IPA Pronunciation

–noun 1. a dramatic form that does not observe the laws of cause and effect and that exaggerates emotion and emphasizes plot or action at the expense of characterization.

I'm just gonna wait for you to make a correction since I know English may not be your first language.

[DocGonzo]

Easy there big fella; no one is letting the gamblers off the hook from that side of the policy isle. To fix the problem, however, requires us to cut off the source of their gambling wealth. People will always be people; good and bad, greedy and generous, and all that shit. To fix the system, you must start at the source: the Fed.

dopey me i guess...i thought you started with criminals who "robbed the liquor store" rather than with the guy who "set the price for buying the guns"

nobody is forced into being a criminal or committing fraud...and the "devil made me do it" is NEVER justification for any ethics violation, imo

i agree...the Fed has problems and needs fixing, however...as i pointed out, this rush to scapegoat the Fed and skip over the errors that the Market itself committed is just as much bullshit as any other bit of idiocy

now, as i have demonstrated, the video link actually fucking says it's the Feds fault, not the poor Market who couldn't help themselves over leverage and commit fraud...and hence you fuck up the entire thesis by building upon a single false postulate used as an axiom...

you know that

that's all i was pointing out, and even said there was a lot of good shit in there up until that point

see, there's where my problem has always been with the idea of laissez faire, con men, gamblers and criminals...

unless and until you can oversee and enforce against those, hold actual people personally accountable...then it just doesn't work cuz the crooks fuck everything up by breaking the very feedback loops that are supposed to self regulate the Market

the bailout fails because not only did it not let the Market function and eliminate the bad institutions, but the criminals who caused a lot of this shit are walking away millionaires...

and things like Schiff blaming the big bad Fed, rather than looking at ALL the systemic variables are NOT helping in finding viable solutions

hope that helps...

[Jezrith]

they palm the Ace about 8 minutes in..."they let them go out and leverage it up"

implying that somehow it's the Fed's responsibility, and not the criminals....for violating all kinds of things and over leveraging to 33 to 1, creating fraudulent "insurance" credit swaps and the other derivatives and the rest...

personal and corporate responsibility? nah...the Fed made us do it...that devil!

fucking spare me, please

there's a hell of a lot of good stuff in there, sound thinking and reasonable Policy ideas...but as soon as you go and let the criminals and gamblers in the Market off the hook for being Responsible for their own actions...you lose it with ethics, logic and reason....and me

What you are failing to understand Doc, is that these criminals wouldn't have been able to leverage 33 to 1 if the fed wasn't dumping dirt cheap dollars right into their pockets.

[StainlessSteelRat]

dopey me i guess...i thought you started with criminals who "robbed the liquor store" rather than with the guy who "set the price for buying the guns"

and things like Schiff blaming the big bad Fed, rather than looking at ALL the systemic variables are NOT helping in finding viable solutions

hope that helps...

Well, first, most of them aren't criminals and didn't break any laws. Second, as Jez said, you start w/ the source.

To make a better analogy, you are suggesting we lock up the petty dealers; Schiff et.al. are suggesting we lock up the kingpins (or that the kinpins are the priority).

[Jezrith]

Well, first, most of them aren't criminals and didn't break any laws. Second, as Jez said, you start w/ the source.

To make a better analogy, you are suggesting we lock up the petty dealers; Schiff et.al. are suggesting we lock up the kingpins (or that the kinpins are the priority).

Indeed, if my car engine is overheating, I shouldn't expect that a new set of tires will fix the problem. The systemic failure occurred in monetary policy, that is where you should look to start fixing things.

[DocGonzo]

i'll stick with my gun/liquor store robbery analogy

yeah...the Fed made borrowing cheap for the short, overnight rate

how that fuck anyone thinks that excuses leveraging 33 to 1 i have no clue, or how that excuses the criminals who committed fraud with "credit swaps" that were supposed to "act like insurance" but were called something different so they weren't regulated like insurance...

and the miscreants then promptly took the fees and didn't set aside enough "bank" to cover their losses should those "credit swaps" come due...which they did

THAT, along with $4 a gallon gasoline, is what unravelled the entire ponzi scheme that Wall street created with the cheap credit...no one made them do it...they took advantage of cheap borrowing...fine and good, but then did unethical things with it they never would have if someone had been minding the store rather than encouraging them to "do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law"

but i'm fairly certain no one will shift form their Ideology over simple things like factual data and clear causality chains...


no worries, and thanks for the convo you two

i'll leave the rest to Worship at the RP cult of Personality

[Vessol]

Peter Schiff is my God.

[DocGonzo]

Peter Schiff is my God.

can you deliver these clay shoes then?

[Silverhandorder]

i'll stick with my gun/liquor store robbery analogy

yeah...the Fed made borrowing cheap for the short, overnight rate

how that fuck anyone thinks that excuses leveraging 33 to 1 i have no clue, or how that excuses the criminals who committed fraud with "credit swaps" that were supposed to "act like insurance" but were called something different so they weren't regulated like insurance...

and the miscreants then promptly took the fees and didn't set aside enough "bank" to cover their losses should those "credit swaps" come due...which they did

THAT, along with $4 a gallon gasoline, is what unravelled the entire ponzi scheme that Wall street created with the cheap credit...no one made them do it...they took advantage of cheap borrowing...fine and good, but then did unethical things with it they never would have if someone had been minding the store rather than encouraging them to "do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law"

but i'm fairly certain no one will shift form their Ideology over simple things like factual data and clear causality chains...


no worries, and thanks for the convo you two

i'll leave the rest to Worship at the RP cult of Personality
Without the FED controlled interest rate they would leverage at most 5 to 1. Then them failing would not effect as many other people.

[Jezrith]

how that fuck anyone thinks that excuses leveraging 33 to 1 i have no clue, or how that excuses the criminals who committed fraud with "credit swaps" that were supposed to "act like insurance" but were called something different so they weren't regulated like insurance...


I don't think anyone says it excuses them. Wanting to fix the root cause doesn't mean you are providing an excuse for the symptoms.


THAT, along with $4 a gallon gasoline, is what unravelled the entire ponzi scheme that Wall street created with the cheap credit...no one made them do it...they took advantage of cheap borrowing...fine and good,


It's not fine and good, it's the whole source of the problem in the first place. Did they have to act unethical? Of course not, but if we would have had a sound monetary policy, the actions of these people would have been irrelevant. The root cause was bad monetary policy, the rest is just incidentals.

[Bissen]

so...while i agree there's a lot that needs to be done to fix fiscal policy, a solid monetary standard, abolishing the Fed and properly setting up the banking system...with the government being the ONLY one that can print money, not some private subcontracting entity, and assured criminal prosecutions for white collar crimes with sentences and penalties scaled to drug crimes...on and on


The government is like a Chinese dry cleaner with a casino in the backroom. The casino being the fed.
You do know this doc?

Now grab that fricking hay fork and make at lynch mob. Then march to 1600... Or start at wall street. This is THE ONLY WAY to ever fix things in your country. Your constitution is weeping as it is.

Call if you need crazy vikings to back ya up.