View Full Version : Obaman to end Non leagal detention
5%Luck
11-10-2008, 02:01 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081110/ap_on_el_pr/obama_guantanamo
Looks like its in the works for those held beyond the law without representation to allow them to have a trial in the U.S. Ending this STAIN on the fundamentals of American justice is seemingly in the forefront of Obama's to do list.
Finlay news broke of this most important degradation of moralistic America.
Thank you all for your eager anticipation and faith.
PrimalSign
11-10-2008, 02:05 PM
The first good thing I've heard from his administration. :D
Time for me to sip some of that cool-aid.
Aramoro
11-10-2008, 02:12 PM
Would be alright I guess... As long as they're trials don't take place in our court system. If they are going on trial it should be through our military court system and not tried as American citizens are.
antihero-zero
11-10-2008, 02:14 PM
I'm waiting for the incoming, "he's letting the terrorists go!" responses. Primal, weren't you just tricked into outrage over a fictional moon war that Obama started with China?
Would be alright I guess... As long as they're trials don't take place in our court system. If they are going on trial it should be through our military court system and not tried as American citizens are.
Impressive. A critical response to this so quickly. I'm glad "war" prisoners not being given trials barely seems to offend you.
PrimalSign
11-10-2008, 02:18 PM
I'm waiting for the incoming, "he's letting the terrorists go!" responses. Primal, weren't you just tricked into outrage over a fictional moon war that Obama started with China?
Tricked? If you consider demanding a source from Yin "tricked", then sure.
Don't think Yin was just trolling either. That guy has a thing for hating America.
hardboiled
11-10-2008, 02:19 PM
I like how they handle these things in China.
Brekken
11-10-2008, 02:23 PM
Excellent news. If they can end the warrantless wiretapping, active deployment of units on our own soil in violation of posse comitatus, scale back carnivore to something resembling constitutional and illegal domestic surveilance of citizens that would be even better.
Edit : Oh and the Patriot act too
Edit 2 : And torture
Weeking
11-10-2008, 02:24 PM
He's letting the terrorists go. Yay!
antihero-zero
11-10-2008, 02:27 PM
Tricked? If you consider demanding a source from Yin "tricked", then sure.
Don't think Yin was just trolling either. That guy has a thing for hating America.
Oh, my bad, I didn't realize you were the one shrewd one in that thread. But he was trolling, hate for America aside, his claim was that he didn't speak English so he used a Chinese translator... he obviously speaks English.
The first good thing I've heard from his administration. :D
Time for me to sip some of that cool-aid.
So reversing 200 of Bush's policies is a bad thing? :rolleyes:
PrimalSign
11-10-2008, 02:33 PM
he obviously speaks English.
Heh. Now that depends on what you'd call English.
Either he had to get the first post from somewhere else, or he has been trolling us with piss poor grammar/spelling for a long time. I won't rule out the latter though.
Silverhandorder
11-10-2008, 02:34 PM
Mmmmm goood change.
antihero-zero
11-10-2008, 02:35 PM
Fuck I hope Obama tries this current administration for illegally lying about the terms of the war. If Bush's cabinet isn't made an example of during his term, I'm going to be very disappointed.
PrimalSign
11-10-2008, 02:38 PM
So reversing 200 of Bush's policies is a bad thing? :rolleyes:
Without knowing exactly what he is reversing, I'm not going to jump to the "OMG BUSH BAD" conclusion and assume it's automatically a good thing. If what he reverses turns out being the worst of it, then I'd give another point (or 200) to Obama.
PrimalSign
11-10-2008, 02:40 PM
Fuck I hope Obama tries this current administration for illegally lying about the terms of the war. If Bush's cabinet isn't made an example of during his term, I'm going to be very disappointed.
Last I heard, Kucinech was leading that front (or at least was a major part of it). I don't believe they had enough evidence to prove Bush's team actually lied about it though.
hardboiled
11-10-2008, 02:41 PM
Without knowing exactly what he is reversing, I'm not going to jump to the "OMG BUSH BAD" conclusion and assume it's automatically a good thing. If what he reverses turns out being the worst of it, then I'd give another point (or 200) to Obama.
He's just reversing the Bush policies that allowed businesses to do business freely.
antihero-zero
11-10-2008, 02:41 PM
Without knowing exactly what he is reversing, I'm not going to jump to the "OMG BUSH BAD" conclusion and assume it's automatically a good thing. If what he reverses turns out being the worst of it, then I'd give another point (or 200) to Obama.
What did Bush do that you support? I can't think of a single policy that was implemented well, and I'm a moderate. (I took a test to determine if I was Republican or Democrat in a government course, and I scored 50% each.)
Silverhandorder
11-10-2008, 02:43 PM
What did Bush do that you support? I can't think of a single policy that was implemented well, and I'm a moderate. (I took a test to determine if I was Republican or Democrat in a government course, and I scored 50% each.)
Gov course is not the best way to find out your ideology.
antihero-zero
11-10-2008, 02:44 PM
Gov course is not the best way to find out your ideology.
Oh yeah, what is?
Brekken
11-10-2008, 02:44 PM
Fuck I hope Obama tries this current administration for illegally lying about the terms of the war. If Bush's cabinet isn't made an example of during his term, I'm going to be very disappointed.
Last I heard, Kucinech was leading that front (or at least was a major part of it). I don't believe they had enough evidence to prove Bush's team actually lied about it though.
Ford set a sort of precedent by pardoning Nixon. His rationale was that while Nixon didn't deserve it, that the OFFICE did and dragging a former President thru trial would damage the office forever. Dunno how Obama feels about it but there have to be few indeed who don't acknowledge many things done by this administration were illegal.
Without knowing exactly what he is reversing, I'm not going to jump to the "OMG BUSH BAD" conclusion and assume it's automatically a good thing. If what he reverses turns out being the worst of it, then I'd give another point (or 200) to Obama.
Well you pretty much said it, though, his policies only range from bad to worse, so reversing any of them is a good thing.
PrimalSign
11-10-2008, 02:46 PM
What did Bush do that you support? I can't think of a single policy that was implemented well, and I'm a moderate. (I took a test to determine if I was Republican or Democrat in a government course, and I scored 50% each.)
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=50780
One of the things that made me think he wasn't all bad.
You might disagree, but I prefer to limit the government's ability to seize property to where it's absolutely necessary.
Lictor
11-10-2008, 02:54 PM
He's letting the terrorists go. Yay!
Many of them are no more a terrorist than you or me.
antihero-zero
11-10-2008, 02:55 PM
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=50780
One of the things that made me think he wasn't all bad.
You might disagree, but I prefer to limit the government's ability to seize property to where it's absolutely necessary.
I don't see anything wrong with this bill, but I'm no property expert and don't know enough about it.
The thing about Bush was that even his good policies, like SMART grants for math and science students with good grades, were implemented horribly, and caused financial aid to get screwed up repeatedly for me. The idea of the bill was sound, which was to encourage US students to educate themselves in the sciences, so we can stop bringing in foreign workers to fill these jobs, which are in high demand here. But his admin fucked it all up.
5%Luck
11-10-2008, 03:00 PM
Its my opinion that if the constitutional frame of justice isnt enough then they should be killed in a battle with police. If they really do intend to suicide themselves without a proper martyr-ism then yes they may take some with them but not nearly as bad as a "full life" spent against the grain. So be it.
Mazer
11-10-2008, 03:02 PM
Ford set a sort of precedent by pardoning Nixon. His rationale was that while Nixon didn't deserve it, that the OFFICE did and dragging a former President thru trial would damage the office forever. Dunno how Obama feels about it but there have to be few indeed who don't acknowledge many things done by this administration were illegal.
Clinton was impeached for lying about a bj... But we should forgive Bush for lying to start a war and shit on the constitution in order to "save the office from damage"?
Sounds kind of redic.
lordbelerial
11-10-2008, 03:09 PM
Clinton was impeached for lying about a bj... But we should forgive Bush for lying to start a war and shit on the constitution in order to "save the office from damage"?
Sounds kind of redic.
he wasn't successfully impeached though, cause that shit is some bs...who the hell really fucking cares if he got a damn bj, he can get as damn many as he wants... man that shit pissed me off
Lethn
11-10-2008, 03:09 PM
He's just reversing the Bush policies that allowed businesses to do business freely.
And buy the government in the process woopee!
He's just reversing the Bush policies that allowed businesses to do business freely.
Proof?
lordbelerial
11-10-2008, 03:10 PM
The first good thing I've heard from his administration. :D
Time for me to sip some of that cool-aid.
yeah, I'm against a lot of the stuff obama wants, but reversing some of the just moronic shit, especially "executive orders" that bush passed will at least be slightly refreshing.
but you can keep the koolaid
Silverhandorder
11-10-2008, 03:17 PM
Uh I read in a less optimistic article that Obama will be replacing those with more retarded shit. He wants to write an executive order that will let him act without congressional aproval. Anyways time will tell.
5%Luck
11-10-2008, 03:23 PM
Uh I read in a less optimistic article that Obama will be replacing those with more retarded shit. He wants to write an executive order that will let him act without congressional aproval. Anyways time will tell.
With out a link its not true!
Silverhandorder
11-10-2008, 03:24 PM
With out a link its not true!
Even with the link its not worth shit until he implements it or not.
lordbelerial
11-10-2008, 03:34 PM
Uh I read in a less optimistic article that Obama will be replacing those with more retarded shit. He wants to write an executive order that will let him act without congressional aproval. Anyways time will tell.
but he's the messiah, he can do that already zomg!
Mazer
11-10-2008, 03:42 PM
but he's the messiah, he can do that already zomg!
Hey, you're from Norway. Stop making fun of the guy, that isn't very European.
Brekken
11-10-2008, 03:54 PM
he wasn't successfully impeached though, cause that shit is some bs...who the hell really fucking cares if he got a damn bj, he can get as damn many as he wants... man that shit pissed me off
This is a different animal. Nixon had resigned and was under many different investigations simultaneously. Who knows what the trials would have been like but it would have made OJ's circus seem like small potatoes. Impeaching a sitting president is not something the Dem's were prepared to do during the middle of two wars and even if they did, you can be sure Cheney would have pardoned him after he was removed.
Obama legitimately seems to be looking to unify right now, whatever his motives for it. I suspect that with that in mind he won't push his justice department to investigate or prosecute.
Ziegler
11-10-2008, 04:11 PM
CLinton wasnt impeached for aBJ...He was impeached for lying under oath before a congressional hearing. Tantamount to perjury.
I heard this morning that obama wants to recind the executive order banning federal funding of stem cells, and the one that just recently(you know, back when gas was $5 a gallon and democrats wanted to seem like they were doing something and ok'd drilling)....well, obama evidently wants to recind that and not allow the drilling afterall....suprised?
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081109/ap_on_go_pr_wh/obama
Aramoro
11-10-2008, 04:18 PM
Impressive. A critical response to this so quickly. I'm glad "war" prisoners not being given trials barely seems to offend you.
"War" prisoners? Is that what we call terrorists now? I was under the impression that captured enemy soldiers were "war" prisoners, not radical extremists that blow up buildings with planes killing "only" civilians.
Aramoro
11-10-2008, 04:25 PM
What did Bush do that you support? I can't think of a single policy that was implemented well, and I'm a moderate. (I took a test to determine if I was Republican or Democrat in a government course, and I scored 50% each.)
Lol fomg! Let me see if I get this straight, so if you were to take a test that determined your sexuality and the outcome was that you were a flaming ****, would you start dating the same sex?
Are you talking about the terroist? Which are not Americans, and do not fall under the AMERICAN constitution?
If that's the people you are referring to, then Obama is a fucktard. They will take their freedom, then take some American lives. Its why they were in the prison in the first place. lol
lordbelerial
11-10-2008, 04:52 PM
Lol fomg! Let me see if I get this straight, so if you were to take a test that determined your sexuality and the outcome was that you were a flaming ****, would you start dating the same sex?
YES! GOD YES!
lordbelerial
11-10-2008, 04:52 PM
Are you talking about the terroist? Which are not Americans, and do not fall under the AMERICAN constitution?
If that's the people you are referring to, then Obama is a fucktard. They will take their freedom, then take some American lives. Its why they were in the prison in the first place. lol
I wouldn't try them in the American courts, but I would in military
I wouldn't try them in the American courts, but I would in military
Yah, I'm ok with them being tried in military courts. Death Penalty attached for the guilty. However, Obama seems to be stating "our legal system can handle this". That makes me worry a bit. I believe that tard is planning to let them get tried under our already over-worked legal system.
Obama blows, and gives change.
Skree
11-10-2008, 05:16 PM
Are you talking about the terroist? Which are not Americans, and do not fall under the AMERICAN constitution?
If that's the people you are referring to, then Obama is a fucktard. They will take their freedom, then take some American lives. Its why they were in the prison in the first place. lolAnd you determined that they were all terrorists from what information ?
Skree
Ziegler
11-10-2008, 05:30 PM
Yah, I'm ok with them being tried in military courts. Death Penalty attached for the guilty. However, Obama seems to be stating "our legal system can handle this". That makes me worry a bit. I believe that tard is planning to let them get tried under our already over-worked legal system.
Obama blows, and gives change.
Here's the kicker....so let's say we decide to give them..all the legal protection granted under the US law system.
1) they werent read their rights
2) They were denied due process
3)they have been held longer than allowed before charges could be filed..
Sounds to me like if we put them in the american legal system, they all walk. <<stress the period
Jezrith
11-10-2008, 05:39 PM
I'm waiting for the incoming, "he's letting the terrorists go!" responses.
Well, if they weren't terrorists before they went to Git-Mo, they probably are now...
Serenius
11-10-2008, 05:47 PM
Right now we are detaining civilians of foreign countries who are not soldiers and much of the time not a threat. Why the rest of the world hasn't flipped shit about this I do not know.
Jezrith
11-10-2008, 05:52 PM
Fuck I hope Obama tries this current administration for illegally lying about the terms of the war. If Bush's cabinet isn't made an example of during his term, I'm going to be very disappointed.
Prepare to be very disappointed...
antihero-zero
11-10-2008, 11:42 PM
"War" prisoners? Is that what we call terrorists now? I was under the impression that captured enemy soldiers were "war" prisoners, not radical extremists that blow up buildings with planes killing "only" civilians.
Yeah, those taxi cab drivers working in Iraq that we were reported to have been imprisoned and abused were the true masterminds of destruction. You do realize many of those prisoners were taken from Iraq, not Afghanistan, right? You're the kill without thinking about the consequences type, right?
And I am gay. Are you asking me out, because I do have standards.
Uh I read in a less optimistic article that Obama will be replacing those with more retarded shit. He wants to write an executive order that will let him act without congressional aproval. Anyways time will tell.
I don't know if my response to this got deleted by the mods, but since I am sick and received no mail about it, I'm going to assume I made a mistake. :)
I believe you have a spoof thread about Obama declaring moon war on China to be outraged about. You were about the most outraged in this community about that, and then the same day you post this and pretend you don't need a source. Evolution > you.
Update: Oh snap, I just taught myself! Evolution > forumfall > me. I just realized I was thinking of another user. Haha. I better go check to see if that guy even posted on the moon wars thread...
cosimo84
11-10-2008, 11:45 PM
Don't we already have overcrowded prisons?
Isn't the court system constantly overrun with more cases than they have time for?
Why are we making way for PoWs who were never citizens to begin with?
Sounds dumb.
What are the motives for this?
BladeSLicer
11-10-2008, 11:49 PM
Last I heard, Kucinech was leading that front (or at least was a major part of it). I don't believe they had enough evidence to prove Bush's team actually lied about it though.
Well if Bush lied/fabricated to get us into Iraq, that means the British, Russians, and Germans were all in on it as well, as they had both similar and even more damning intelligence pointing to WMD's in Iraq.
Reigngod
11-11-2008, 12:07 AM
Well if Bush lied/fabricated to get us into Iraq, that means the British, Russians, and Germans were all in on it as well, as they had both similar and even more damning intelligence pointing to WMD's in Iraq.
We didnt need a reason to go back to Iraq...the original war was never resolved...just stopped with a ceasefire so actually...Bush could have said he was going to attack Iraq for their Pink stuffed bunnies of awesomeness and it would still be just a continuation of '91.
PirateGlen
11-11-2008, 01:20 AM
Are you talking about the terroist? Which are not Americans, and do not fall under the AMERICAN constitution?
If that's the people you are referring to, then Obama is a fucktard. They will take their freedom, then take some American lives. Its why they were in the prison in the first place. lol
All persons within the US, regardless of their "americanness", are entitled to the protections of the US Constitution.
There's been terrorist attacks before, and our justice system convicted the guilty. I don't see how a real trial turns into a get out of jail free card. The Bush administration has tried 3 times to deny prisoner's their rights under the constitution, and the supreme court has overturned such laws every time.
Tsukae
11-11-2008, 01:37 AM
Don't we already have overcrowded prisons?
Yes we do but that is because of our strict penalties for even some petty crimes. Also we have very strict charges for drug related crimes. (even weed!)
Desperado[1G]
11-11-2008, 01:40 AM
All persons within the US, regardless of their "americanness", are entitled to the protections of the US Constitution.
There's been terrorist attacks before, and our justice system convicted the guilty. I don't see how a real trial turns into a get out of jail free card. The Bush administration has tried 3 times to deny prisoner's their rights under the constitution, and the supreme court has overturned such laws every time.
Our justice system has no means of preventing attacks, which is the only reason gitmo exists. Under our law, the detained have the right to remain silent.
PirateGlen
11-11-2008, 03:27 AM
;1930994']Our justice system has no means of preventing attacks, which is the only reason gitmo exists. Under our law, the detained have the right to remain silent.
That's nonsense.
Richard Colvin Reid (also known as Abdul Raheem and often referred to in the media as the shoe bomber) (born August 12, 1973[1]) was convicted on charges of terrorism and is currently serving a life sentence in the United States for attempting to destroy a commercial aircraft in-flight by detonating plastic explosives hidden in his shoes.
There you go: attack prevented.
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