Obama's victory speech

[Nasty]

Pretty epic, even if you don't align with him ideologically.

The man has got some serious speaking skills. He even seems authentic. Reminds of the old school US presidents who were visionaries and not just hardened career politicians.

PS, I vote far right libertarian in my country and I hate taxes. I share your pain on certain domestic issues, but I still think he is the best candidate for the overall benefit of the US. (apart from RP)

[Ori Disciple]

Pretty epic, even if you don't align with him ideologically.

The man has got some serious speaking skills. He even seems authentic. Reminds of the old school US presidents who were visionaries and not just hardened career politicians.

PS, I vote far right libertarian in my country and I hate taxes. I share your pain on certain domestic issues, but I still think he is the best candidate for the overall benefit of the US. (apart from RP)

It is one hell of a speech, Ill say that.
watched it on CNN

[Tzacharu]

Yea, he's a great speaker. I seriously got chills down my spine at the mention of the Berlin Wall. If anything is for certain, his State of the Union addresses will be a hell of a lot better than Bush's.

[Feyrband]

i thought the bulletproof glass on the sides were a nice touch.

[Thaeds]

His speech at the DNC gave me chills like 10 times... My dad said it may go down in history as the best speech ever. (He works for the department of state). I didn't like this one quite as much, but Obama sure is one hell of a speaker.

[verlox2]

Oh if only it wasn't there.

[Nasty]

It is one hell of a speech, Ill say that.
watched it on CNN

Yea, he's a great speaker. I seriously got chills down my spine at the mention of the Berlin Wall. If anything is for certain, his State of the Union addresses will be a hell of a lot better than Bush's.


Embarassed to admit I also felt a slight chill triggered by certain parts of that speech. Charismatic leaders ftw.

i thought the bulletproof glass on the sides were a nice touch.

I saw the assassination play out like 20 times in my mind throughout that speech. I feel the bulletproof glass was legit.



Topped by Biden's SLICK white smile and haircut it became an epic.

[angelfang]

He's a brilliant orator, a gift he was born with. Hopefully he delivers his promises, the Dems have control over the House and the Senate so he should've have much excuses.

[angelfang]

Embarassed to admit I also felt a slight chill triggered by certain parts of that speech. Charismatic leaders ftw.



I saw the assassination play out like 20 times in my mind throughout that speech. I feel the bulletproof glass was legit.



Topped by Biden's SLICK white smile and haircut it became an epic.

:lmao:

no kidding. i found myself anticipating the BOOM! and OHH SHIITT!!

[Ltldogg]

I think Obama will be a great leader; authentic and caring about the American people. His acceptance speech was perfect. McCain's speech was also great and is a testament to him as a great person.

I want all the politicians to embrace the results to work together to make positive changes. I really hope going forward, our government can return to good relations with other countries of the worlds and reverse Bush's mistakes.

[heroshade]

I missed the speech, hopefully it will be on the internet soon. In anybody finds it, PM me.

[Protonix]

shit, just you guys wait till Proto for President 2016

[DeathByCactus]

God I hope no one shoots him. He is going to be a curse enough to the 2nd amendment, we don't need some dumbshit giving him more cause to throw out amendments.


Looks like I am buying more rifles tomo... :(

[BlackVolgan]

aww the kids get a new puppy!

[Nasty]

McCain's speech was also great and is a testament to him as a great person.


qft

it showed alot of character

[Traep]

I saw the assassination play out like 20 times in my mind throughout that speech. I feel the bulletproof glass was legit.

Word. I was nervous when he first walked out even. I was glad to see that glass.

[Paganini]

Word, pretty good speech

[Royser]

Pretty epic, even if you don't align with him ideologically.

The man has got some serious speaking skills. He even seems authentic. Reminds of the old school US presidents who were visionaries and not just hardened career politicians.

PS, I vote far right libertarian in my country and I hate taxes. I share your pain on certain domestic issues, but I still think he is the best candidate for the overall benefit of the US. (apart from RP)

You nailed it, he's a great speaker, there's no question there, but i fear that's all to him. He lies through his teeth, but his speeches are too epic to notice, can't speak through everything though.

[Layedballer]

Word. I was nervous when he first walked out even. I was glad to see that glass.

I for some reason imagined like 20 rednecks running up firing, I bet he was shitting himself

[Xtra-Medium]

u just cant resist when obama spits that hot fiya!

[Protonix]

oddly enough, an assassination would probably be the worst thing for the 2nd amendment.

[Bratus]

he looked so pissed off while he was giving it

[Desperado[1G]]

I for some reason imagined like 20 rednecks running up firing, I bet he was shitting himself

You're fucking pathetic

[verlox2]

I hope Obama spontaneously combusts.

[Silverhandorder]

I for some reason imagined like 20 rednecks running up firing, I bet he was shitting himself

With a cordon of a million supporters nothing can touch him.

[m0j0mann]

Pure epicness. One of his best, certainly.

[Layedballer]

;1902865']You're fucking pathetic

Err other than the obvious, why?
I know if I was the first black president I would be quite nervous about standing in front of a bunch of people.

[DeathByCactus]

oddly enough, an assassination would probably be the worst thing for the 2nd amendment.

Tell that to stupid people.

[Protonix]

I told it to forumfall, it often times doesn't get any more stupid.

[kordoyn]

Some of you like to get your panties all wet over nothing don't you? The speech was epic when compared to a Bush speech, it was only mediocre compared to Obama's DNC speech.

The glass was a classy touch.

[Bremen]

Enjoyed the Yes We Can part of the speech, was also really surprised at the quality of McCains speech

[Nasty]

Some of you like to get your panties all wet over nothing don't you? The speech was epic when compared to a Bush speech, it was only mediocre compared to Obama's DNC speech.

The glass was a classy touch.

I'm gonna have to review the DNC speech. I guess the context fueled this one somewhat.

[LanMandragon]

Pretty epic, even if you don't align with him ideologically.

The man has got some serious speaking skills. He even seems authentic. Reminds of the old school US presidents who were visionaries and not just hardened career politicians.

PS, I vote far right libertarian in my country and I hate taxes. I share your pain on certain domestic issues, but I still think he is the best candidate for the overall benefit of the US. (apart from RP)

I agree.

The hardened right doesn't seem to understand what he is saying. That speech was the equivalency of Kennedy asking us to go to the moon.

[Drafli]

If only i could enjoy a good speech. Instead i usually find myself thinking of the one who actually wrote the speech, and how he/she was patting themselves on the back at how awesome it was going to sound to the enraptured masses.

[Vessol]

I enjoyed it, he is a very good speaker. Up there with Martin Luther King Jr., Kennedy and all the great orators.

Like others, I couldn't help but thinking any second "BOOM! Obama brainz!" :\.

[Vanno]

Barack isn't so much a great speech writer, but his oratory and non-verbal communication is impeccable; he has tone, inflection, and body language down to a science.

[LanMandragon]

I enjoyed it, he is a very good speaker. Up there with Martin Luther King Jr., Kennedy and all the great orators.

Like others, I couldn't help but thinking any second "BOOM! Obama brainz!" :\.

No shit.

The glass was something I was happy about.

[Baenor]

he looked so pissed off while he was giving it

At times you could tell he was thinking "shut the fuck up, I'm trying to talk here".

I was pretty impressed with it.

[DeathByCactus]

I told it to forumfall, it often times doesn't get any more stupid.

qft

[Slisk]

One hell of a speech. I was swelling with patriotic pride and I'm not even American. I could hear the world sighing with collective relief. Interesting to see what happens next. After all change depends on more than retoric.

[Virtra]

Great speech, he's very good at that.
shit, just you guys wait till Proto for President 2016Let me know when you start your campaign so I can move back to DC and run it for ya.

[Protonix]

Will do!

You won't even have to work that hard, I expect a landslide victory.

[Slypieguy]

Over/under on how long until we have troops in Sudan/Congo.... 1.5 years

[Desperado[1G]]

One hell of a speech. I was swelling with patriotic pride and I'm not even American. I could hear the world sighing with collective relief. Interesting to see what happens next. After all change depends on more than retoric.

I hope the world is prepared to defend itself for a while, because he has neither the inclination nor the experience necessary to support our allies.

I feel bad for nations like Japan, South Korea, Poland, Ukraine etc. Most of all, I feel fucking terrible for the people of Iraq. They've only just begun to have hope for their future, and in 18 months from now it will all be crushed.

I pray I am wrong.

[Protonix]

Or, those people in Iraq could save their own country and buy into their own hope.

[Virtra]

Will do!

You won't even have to work that hard, I expect a landslide victory.Well, how could you lose with a cute kitten strategy? It hits all demographic sectors, and exploits the internetz for maximum electoral pwnage.

[CheshireKat]

;1903084']I hope the world is prepared to defend itself for a while, because he has neither the inclination nor the experience necessary to support our allies.

Excellent IMO. It'll do them good to learn to help themselves for a while. We gotta fix our shit first.

[Revolver777]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/27546437#27546437

(Assuming that's it)

It was definitely a good speech, but after seeing everyone's hype here I must say it was nowhere near "the greatest speech evar!1"

[angelfang]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/27546437#27546437

(Assuming that's it)

It was definitely a good speech, but after seeing everyone's hype here I must say it was nowhere near "the greatest speech evar!1"

where 2 buy dvd

[Spineless_DoO]

It is one hell of a speech, Ill say that.
watched it on CNN

Ya it wasnt bad for a guy who said well nothing.... while saying alot.

[Nafelos]

He referred to America as "a Democracy" and "not just a collection of individuals"... otherwise he made a pretty good speech. I am really happy that African Americans now finally feel that there is nothing holding them back, even though I thought that moment came years ago.

[Ammon777]

Pretty epic, even if you don't align with him ideologically.

The man has got some serious speaking skills. He even seems authentic. Reminds of the old school US presidents who were visionaries and not just hardened career politicians.

PS, I vote far right libertarian in my country and I hate taxes. I share your pain on certain domestic issues, but I still think he is the best candidate for the overall benefit of the US. (apart from RP)
Yeah... I thought that speech was killer.
Ya it wasnt bad for a guy who said well nothing.... while saying alot.
He said quite a bit, you are just fucking deafened by the sound of your brain gears constantly grinding.

[Spineless_DoO]

Oh man when he said "the dream of our founders is still alive" I cracked up LOL at the pub. I near spit my entire beer on the bartender.

[Silverhandorder]

This guy tries really hard to disarm you. If we are to beleive what he said shit will be al peachy. However when you factor in reality you know there will be a whole new era of government expansion and corruption.

[Eclipso]

I missed the speech, hopefully it will be on the internet soon. In anybody finds it, PM me.



http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/us_elections_2008/7710079.stm


think this is the full version.

[Desperado[1G]]

He referred to America as "a Democracy" and "not just a collection of individuals"... otherwise he made a pretty good speech. I am really happy that African Americans now finally feel that there is nothing holding them back, even though I thought that moment came years ago.

Oh no, we're still racist. This malignant entity known as "the south" is chock full of them.

[Krylas]

I'm more relieved that McCain lost than that Obama won.

[Nasty]

I'm more relieved that McCain lost than that Obama won.

I'm just happy Palin lost. I never had that much against McCain, although I had little faith in his foreign policy and his judgement when picking Palin for VP.

[Ammon777]

Ive already made a thread about what I think about Palin.

And I paid a hefty price. :(

[Khantrah]

I just got back from the rally. Didn't vote for Obama and don't generally support him, but it was a pretty awesome spectacle to experience. Nothing quite like watching the election results on CNN come in on a massive screen with 120,000 people screaming behind you. Chicago was a sea of people in every direction for blocks on end at 12am on a Tuesday night. Super surreal.

[ineluki]

;1903084']I hope the world is prepared to defend itself for a while, because he has neither the inclination nor the experience necessary to support our allies.

I feel bad for nations like Japan, South Korea, Poland, Ukraine etc. Most of all, I feel fucking terrible for the people of Iraq. They've only just begun to have hope for their future, and in 18 months from now it will all be crushed.

I pray I am wrong.

Sorry but the people of Iraq want the USA out of their.100S OF 1000S march just the other month protesting against America. Let`s drop the bush rhetoric now,his time is over.

Bush should be arrested for war crimes.

[Titus Ultor]

;1903084']I hope the world is prepared to defend itself for a while, because he has neither the inclination nor the experience necessary to support our allies.

I feel bad for nations like Japan, South Korea, Poland, Ukraine etc. Most of all, I feel fucking terrible for the people of Iraq. They've only just begun to have hope for their future, and in 18 months from now it will all be crushed.

I pray I am wrong.

I pray you are right. If we actually pull all of the resources, money and lives we're wasting on foreign intervention and focus on ourselves, I will cry tears of joy.

[nathanpinard]

i thought the bulletproof glass on the sides were a nice touch.

We sure you aren't talking about the teleprompters?

[Desperado[1G]]

I pray you are right. If we actually pull all of the resources, money and lives we're wasting on foreign intervention and focus on ourselves, I will cry tears of joy.

If you think the world hates us now, wait until we abandon them. The threat of a US response is the sole reason many nations are even able to exist.

[Nasty]

;1903335']If you think the world hates us now, wait until we abandon them. The threat of a US response is the sole reason many nations are even able to exist.

I'm gonna agree with this. I can't stress this hard enough when I debate with people who have anti-american sentiments. The US has saved the free world at least twice.

At the same time though, if you didn't intervene at certain given points in time, your existence would be challenged. It works both ways. If you have the capability of caring for your allies in times of peace, you're better off when tides turn and you actually need them.

No matter what dumb fucks say about the US or what the dumb fucks say about Europe, we'll be holding eachothers nuts until the day we decide the world needs to melt in a nuclear holocaust.

[kensha]

So Obama won? Sorry am not really keeping up with the selections

[Lethn]

Yeah it's almost official now, the media are in a huge buzz about it but the votes haven't all been counted yet.

[Ludo]

;1903335']If you think the world hates us now, wait until we abandon them. The threat of a US response is the sole reason many nations are even able to exist.

Stop being so tight in ur anus.

Why do you even care?

[nathanpinard]

Yeah it's almost official now, the media are in a huge buzz about it but the votes haven't all been counted yet.

No, it is official. He creamed McCain in the electoral vote.

[Suitepee]

I wonder what the racist segment of America will do this morning....

Right Obama,get UK troops out of Iraq and Afghanistan please. We don't want to be involved in anymore petty American wars. That's a change I'd like to see.

[DR.NUMBERS]

I wonder what the racist segment of America will do this morning....

Right Obama,get UK troops out of Iraq and Afghanistan please. We don't want to be involved in anymore petty American wars. That's a change I'd like to see.


It's your leaders job to get your troops out. We can't order them to do anything. You could/can have left/leave of your own choice anytime you wanted, complain to Tony/Gordon about that one.

[Aragoni]

IMO McCain held a better speech. :)

[Pcheez]

Ey grats obama then.

Yeah i dislike america's foreign policies, but it does in fact protect many weak nations from being obliterated by bigger ones.

Still, most of the time the US intervenes in a country out of greed, they end up having a few military bases and bam, its under the US's protective wing.


Whatever, i hope obama can turn a cold shoulder to Israel instead of rimming them like bush did so Israel would learn to act like a proper sovereign nation, no an extension of a military powerhouse. Without the US's unquestionable backing, most of Israeli leaders would have been locked away for war crimes a looong time ago.. Highly unlikely but one can hope eh?


Either way, hope Obama lives up to all his Change hype.

[Requiamer]

I just watched it on youtube because of the fuzz here, and i found nothing special to it, nothing at all, just a dull speech salted with hope propaganda. Even if i would have probably voted for him if i was from US.
Imo he seam to stand a bit upper because last political years are so fucking bad for US, one of the worst ever political period for US imo. Full of shit and pompous pretension, but that's how US people are anyway whatever side they belong to for years now, since cold war began. This is not due to politicians but rather to the self called US main power force in the world, which is full of shit especially now, every one with a brain knows it, even few US people. So poeple from US stop farting upper than your ass as french said.

Also i live in a land where we raise olive tree and gather fruits from them, all around here they have millennium, so Obama is just an other drop in the see, nothing more.
The only thing you should care about politic imo is to make sure you wont have an other moron as Hitler cover the earth with his shit once more. Something US citizens failed royally those few last years.

[cosimo84]

Pretty epic, even if you don't align with him ideologically.

The man has got some serious speaking skills. He even seems authentic. Reminds of the old school US presidents who were visionaries and not just hardened career politicians.

PS, I vote far right libertarian in my country and I hate taxes. I share your pain on certain domestic issues, but I still think he is the best candidate for the overall benefit of the US. (apart from RP)

Gah, please don't remind me of how fundamentally insane so many people are.

Good speaking skills is like having a fast car, and people's stupidity is gasoline. No one is thinking about where the car is going; they're too focused on how good it looks and that man oh man it's fast.

Ya know who had the best speaking skills? The guy who made public speaking what it is today? Do I need to say his name? Do people know what history is? WTF is wrong with the world.

[Helgeran]

Very epic, let's hope he goes through with it.

I lol'd at the collectivism in it, I'm sure some of you libertarians got the creeps from it.

Edit: I just noticed I watched another speech (prob. of him winning vs. Hillary). lol on me, very Hitler like orating style btw, this guy will be a legend especially if he is a good president (or sets up a bunch of deathcamps).

[Don JoHnson]

I'm gonna agree with this. I can't stress this hard enough when I debate with people who have anti-american sentiments. The US has saved the free world at least twice.

At the same time though, if you didn't intervene at certain given points in time, your existence would be challenged. It works both ways. If you have the capability of caring for your allies in times of peace, you're better off when tides turn and you actually need them.

No matter what dumb fucks say about the US or what the dumb fucks say about Europe, we'll be holding eachothers nuts until the day we decide the world needs to melt in a nuclear holocaust.

twice? when was the first time and when was the second time?

[Helgeran]

twice? when was the first time and when was the second time?
ww1/2

[Youknowho]

Some nameless speech writer will get a nameless medal from a nameless speech writer association.

[Helgeran]

Some nameless speech writer will get a nameless medal from a nameless speech writer association.
That's the custom of the trade.

[Don JoHnson]

ww1/2

they still teach you those lies? wow

[Atnas]

I liked McCains more, but I like Obama overall more. Don't know enough to vote for either.

[Helgeran]

they still teach you those lies? wow
ww1 I'm not too sure but ww2 they absolutely saved Europe. Not from the nazis but from Soviet and only barely.

[Atnas]

ww1 I'm not too sure but ww2 they absolutely saved Europe. Not from the nazis but from Soviet and only barely.

What are you talking about comrade?

[Helgeran]

What are you talking about comrade?
brb STASI

[Requiamer]

The US has saved the free world at least twice.

No they don't, they just participated in the war, they were one of the ally. Many countries where involved in the ally side, US where just a part of it, a substantial part, but only a part of it. Stupid arrogance is stupid, making poeple think they save the world by themself is utterly wrong and pompous. The world saved itself, US is just a part of it, as much as it were a part of the allies.

[Suitepee]

It's your leaders job to get your troops out. We can't order them to do anything. You could/can have left/leave of your own choice anytime you wanted, complain to Tony/Gordon about that one.

Our leaders seem to be America's "bitch",so monkey say monkey do since we already have complained about it countless times.
We'll also jump off the Grand Canyon if America asked us too.

Actually that last idea seems a good way to remove our chav population. Please tell Obama to do that asap.

[sorros]

OBAMA WON! HUZZAH! McFail and Falin LOST! THE US IS SAVED (if only for a few months)!

[Unahim]

I was disappointed at McCain's followers, hearing them boo'ing whenever Obama was mentioned(during their candidates' own speech) was so childish and immature... takes away some of my belief in mankind as a whole

[Crimm]

I was disappointed at McCain's followers, hearing them boo'ing whenever Obama was mentioned(during their candidates' own speech) was so childish and immature... takes away some of my belief in mankind as a whole



I was surprised that no one got lynched at that rally.

[Yobaj]

He's a brilliant orator, a gift he was born with. Hopefully he delivers his promises, the Dems have control over the House and the Senate so he should've have much excuses.

Philibusters, the economy... But otherwise, yeah..
He has stated that his first aassignment will be to create 5 million jobs in green industry. Let's how that goes.

Also, congratulations America, you seem to have elected a good president.

[Lollipop]

Check out Youtube. All of his speaches are epic. We'll be discussing his speaches in rhetoric classes for the next few centuries.

The Republicans shut down congress 92-94. You usually have to build large supermajorities to get anything done. He should be able to get stuff done, though. Americans really show up when stuff goes all to hell. Most of the rest of the time we're apathetic.

[Xtra-Medium]

maybe he did write some of the speeches, or edited them

[Mungad]

The best part was when he starting talking about how change would come from people's service and sacrifice and the crowd was like *crickets*

[swiftbuster]

the best part i think about his speach is that he never broke eye contact once,not even to glance at a piece of paper if he had one at the time.

[Brando]

The best part was when he starting talking about how change would come from people's service and sacrifice and the crowd was like *crickets*

That's why the Dems create programs to do that for them!

[joeapro]

the best part i think about his speach is that he never broke eye contact once,not even to glance at a piece of paper if he had one at the time.

If you noticed there were teleprompters in every direction set forward from the podium .. it's the newest thing since sliced bread to help public speakers look like they're talking to the crowd when on camera.

I think he is a good speaker from what I've noticed. Not so many "uh"s and "um"s and all that jazz .. BTW, during that speech it almost turned into "obama jtt"

[Kietharr]

I'd really prefer Obama if he didn't have a democratic majority to work with, at least it's not going to be a 60-40 majority. I don't mind him as a person, but his socialist rhetoric kinda scares me. I do think that he'll be good for the spirit of America, he'll inspire a lot of young people to become contributing members of society and his win will show the young students that they can make a difference, but he might just sink us with his economic policies.

[skilletfan]

has outrageous speaking skills for his little experience

[Mushukyou]

Pretty epic, even if you don't align with him ideologically.

The man has got some serious speaking skills. He even seems authentic. Reminds of the old school US presidents who were visionaries and not just hardened career politicians.

PS, I vote far right libertarian in my country and I hate taxes. I share your pain on certain domestic issues, but I still think he is the best candidate for the overall benefit of the US. (apart from RP)

I wish he didn't end his great speech with that stupid "gawd bless everyone" and "gawd bless america" crap. But it will be awhile before we can get an atheist president who doesn't partake in such delusions.

But other than that crap, it was a great speech and I hope he'll be all about equality as he says.

[Mippoose]

Yes, we can.

Hate.

[Killuminati]

I wish he didn't end his great speech with that stupid "gawd bless everyone" and "gawd bless america" crap. But it will be awhile before we can get an atheist president who doesn't partake in such delusions.

But other than that crap, it was a great speech and I hope he'll be all about equality as he says.

militant atheist is militant

[Matriel]

oddly enough, an assassination would probably be the worst thing for the 2nd amendment.

No shit. Aka, the '68 gun control act on the heels of MLK and JFK assassinations.

If some idiot is going to do it, do it with a bomb please, so you don't fuck people that aren't retards.

[Mushukyou]

I'd really prefer Obama if he didn't have a democratic majority to work with, at least it's not going to be a 60-40 majority. I don't mind him as a person, but his socialist rhetoric kinda scares me. I do think that he'll be good for the spirit of America, he'll inspire a lot of young people to become contributing members of society and his win will show the young students that they can make a difference, but he might just sink us with his economic policies.

National healthcare would be GREAT for this country.
It's making everyone healthy.
Government is necessary to keep peoples' rights equal. The republicans would like to keep less government so they can have more control and more power to do as they wish. They are aging dinosaurs.

[DR.NUMBERS]

No shit. Aka, the '68 gun control act on the heels of MLK and JFK assassinations.

If some idiot is going to do it, do it with a bomb please, so you don't fuck people that aren't retards.

Poison. Discretion is always best.

[Carl Ragadamn]

National healthcare would be GREAT for this country.
It's making everyone healthy.
Government is necessary to keep peoples' rights equal. The republicans would like to keep less government so they can have more control and more power to do as they wish. They are aging dinosaurs.

Every time you post you seem to find a new way to lower my opinion of you.

[Aragon]

Finally a President you can take seriously.

Bush was a pathetic fucking retard.

National healthcare is what i hope we will see in the near future. More taxes for the good of all people, not just benefit the already rich.

[Killuminati]

Finally a President you can take seriously.

Bush was a pathetic fucking retard.

National healthcare is what i hope we will see in the near future. More taxes for the good of all people, not just benefit the already rich.

we don't want to turn into Scandinavia thank you very much..

[Aragon]

we don't want to turn into Scandinavia thank you very much..

Thats a sad attitude you have. Did you know that we get alot more healthcare for our money then you american citizens get for the same amount of money?

Infact, Sweden is the most costeffective country in the world when it comes to healthcare. Our system is way superior yours. Sweden is the number one country in healthcare and it's our taxes that is a part of that number one spot.

[Killuminati]

Thats a sad attitude you have. Did you know that we get alot more healthcare for our money then you american citizens get?

Infact, Sweden is the most costeffective country in the world when it comes to healthcare. Our system is way superior yours.

Is that why there are plenty of economists who have done studies on how they should move away from the Scandinavia model?

[Carl Ragadamn]

Thats a sad attitude you have. Did you know that we get alot more healthcare for our money then you american citizens get for the same amount of money?

Infact, Sweden is the most costeffective country in the world when it comes to healthcare. Our system is way superior yours. Sweden is the number one country in healthcare and it's our taxes that is a part of that number one spot.

If you suddenly had to grow your system 30 times larger, would it still run as good?

[Don JoHnson]

Thats a sad attitude you have. Did you know that we get alot more healthcare for our money then you american citizens get for the same amount of money?

Infact, Sweden is the most costeffective country in the world when it comes to healthcare. Our system is way superior yours. Sweden is the number one country in healthcare and it's our taxes that is a part of that number one spot.

Thats not hard, cuz everything is better than a non existing system.

[Aragon]

Is that why there are plenty of economists who have done studies on how they should move away from the Scandinavia model?

Ok give me some quotes on that if you can.

On the studies i read Sweden is on top together with other Scandinavian countries and USA is btw number 30 to 50. American system is a very poor one.

[Mushukyou]

militant atheist is militant

Ok. You make it sound like a bad thing. :)

[Aragon]

If you suddenly had to grow your system 30 times larger, would it still run as good?

Yes i think it would. Your small states can benefit their citizens just as good as Sweden as a country can, or?

[Mushukyou]

Every time you post you seem to find a new way to lower my opinion of you.

That's fine. I know not everyone thinks as well as I do.
I'm governed by reason and logic, so if you can use such to point out that something I'm saying is not correct, you'll get me to listen.
Otherwise, merely saying I'm wrong is not sufficient.

[Carl Ragadamn]

Yes i think it would. Your small states can benefit their citizens just as good as Sweden as a country can, or?

Yes, but it should be handled at the state level, if we try a nationalized system it will fail due to being to big.

[DR.NUMBERS]

Thats a sad attitude you have. Did you know that we get alot more healthcare for our money then you american citizens get for the same amount of money?

Infact, Sweden is the most costeffective country in the world when it comes to healthcare. Our system is way superior yours. Sweden is the number one country in healthcare and it's our taxes that is a part of that number one spot.

I can't wait to see you pay for that in 20 years when your population has sky rocketed due to immigration and all the baby boomers are retiring...

[Killuminati]

Ok give me some quotes on that if you can.

On the studies i read Sweden is on top together with other Scandinavian countries and USA is btw number 30 to 50. American system is a very poor one.

From just typing Scandinavian model in google..

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/510

[SSguy]

;1903084']I hope the world is prepared to defend itself for a while, because he has neither the inclination nor the experience necessary to support our allies.


Our allies don't fucking need support, the rest of the world isn't filled with infants. It would be about damn time the rest of the world started policing itself.


I feel bad for nations like Japan, South Korea, Poland, Ukraine etc. Most of all, I feel fucking terrible for the people of Iraq. They've only just begun to have hope for their future, and in 18 months from now it will all be crushed.

I pray I am wrong.

Then maybe they should have stood up by themselves, instead of letting some other country try to do it for them.

I don't remember a foreign army invading America to give blacks and women equal rights. Fuck their hopes and dreams, they don't deserve any of them if they are not willing to fight for them.

[DR.NUMBERS]

Our allies don't fucking need support, the rest of the world isn't filled with infants. It would be about damn time the rest of the world started policing itself.



Then maybe they should have stood up by themselves, instead of letting some other country try to do it for them.

I don't remember a foreign army invading America to give blacks and women equal rights. Fuck their hopes and dreams, they don't deserve any of them if they are not willing to fight for them.

Amen... Its like every year we give Israel billions of dollars in aid and weapons. What do we get in return? Nothing that the average Joe benefits from, thats for sure. Anyway, they don't need our fucking help they've whooped the Arabs asses in every war so far, even before we gave them any help.

[SSguy]

ww1 I'm not too sure but ww2 they absolutely saved Europe. Not from the nazis but from Soviet and only barely.

Hate to destroy your centralism, but Europe isn't the free world.

[Don JoHnson]

Yes, but it should be handled at the state level, if we try a nationalized system it will fail due to being to big.

great arguments, good points, there is no doubt, you know what you are talking of!

[Don JoHnson]

I can't wait to see you pay for that in 20 years when your population has sky rocketed due to immigration and all the baby boomers are retiring...

yes, cuz we all know immigrants come to a country and just get money from the country without doing anything and they suddenly get ill and take this money, oh and they eat babies, our babies...:bang:

[Carl Ragadamn]

yes, cuz we all know immigrants come to a country and just get money from the country without doing anything and they suddenly get ill and take this money, oh and they eat babies, our babies...:bang:
That seems to be the immigration policy of Britain.

[Don JoHnson]

That seems to be the immigration policy of Britain.

britain has no policy of their own, they ask the US what their policy should be like.

[DR.NUMBERS]

yes, cuz we all know immigrants come to a country and just get money from the country without doing anything and they suddenly get ill and take this money, oh and they eat babies, our babies...:bang:

No, some of them work but they don't generally get as a good jobs and therefore pay less into the system while still taking out the same amount or more. Also, and I know it isn't PC to say this, but many don't work and do come to just live of the government. I see it all the time here in the Netherlands.

People who have been here for a generation or two and still don't speak any dutch or work. Its BS. It means my neighbor, who works his ass off, has to help feed 5 useless mouths. Also, they get subsidized housing, free health care and something like 25,000 a year, which is basically what a teacher or librarian makes for doing nothing. Hell, I wish someone would give me 25,000 and subsidized/free housing for doing nothing.

Already its taking its toll, every year we have to scale back our amenities in order to cut costs and stay in budget. I've lived here for 11 years and I've seen it happen before my eyes. Every year the infrastructure degrades a little bit in the face of rising costs and proportionally less pay-in. Its still good here, for sure, but it IS getting worse. In 10-20 years the government in NL will have to cut many of its social programs and then there will be an absolute SHITSTORM.

[Fro]

Its not as if he writes his speeches...

[Don JoHnson]

No, some of them work but they don't generally get as a good jobs and therefore pay less into the system while still taking out the same amount or more. Also, and I know it isn't PC to say this, but many don't work and do come to just live of the government. I see it all the time here in the Netherlands.

People who have been here for a generation or two and still don't speak any dutch or work. Its BS. It means my neighbor, who works his ass off, has to help feed 5 useless mouths. Also, they get subsidized housing, free health care and something like 25,000 a year, which is basically what a teacher or librarian makes for doing nothing. Hell, I wish someone would give me 25,000 and subsidized/free housing for doing nothing.

ok let me sum this up:
*cry* "Helping people who are in need is bad because my country gives money to people who are not in need"

Well, yeah, you definitively are one of those guys who made sure the average IQ was set from 100 to 90-100! congrats!

[Fro]

No, some of them work but they don't generally get as a good jobs and therefore pay less into the system while still taking out the same amount or more. Also, and I know it isn't PC to say this, but many don't work and do come to just live of the government. I see it all the time here in the Netherlands.

People who have been here for a generation or two and still don't speak any dutch or work. Its BS. It means my neighbor, who works his ass off, has to help feed 5 useless mouths. Also, they get subsidized housing, free health care and something like 25,000 a year, which is basically what a teacher or librarian makes for doing nothing. Hell, I wish someone would give me 25,000 and subsidized/free housing for doing nothing.

What are you talking about? Atleast over here in Britain most of the immigrants do a hell of alot better job then the fat lazy natives. Theres exceptions but most of them do work harder than the average native british person. Asylum seekers aren't allowed to work until they become a full citizen which isn't that easy anymore...

[Floyd]

Part of me is going to miss Bush. :(



My asshole.

[DR.NUMBERS]

ok let me sum this up:
*cry* "Helping people who are in need is bad because my country gives money to people who are not in need"

Well, yeah, you definitively are one of those guys who made sure the average IQ was set from 100 to 90-100! congrats!

You're fucking retarded. Let me sum you up:

"Hey lets give everybodyz free moneys gais!!!! We can just grow some more on the magical money trees! Fuck where it comes from! People who aren;t even citizens deserve it just as much as people who are citizens and work for it!!!"

While you're at it, why don't you give me some of your money.

P.S. I have an IQ of 136, if you don't believe me I show you my MENSA membership.

[Don JoHnson]

You're fucking retarded. Let me some you up:

"Hey lets give everybodyz free moneys gais!!!! We can just grow some more on the magical money trees! Fuck where it comes from! People who aren;t even citizens deserve it just as much as people who are citizens and work for it!!!"

While you're at it, why don't you give me some of your money.

P.S. I have an IQ of 136, if you don't believe me I show you my MENSA membership.

Yes please show me your MENSA membership. you must have failed the reading comprehension part of it

[DR.NUMBERS]

Yes please show me your MENSA membership. you must have failed the reading comprehension part of it

Firstly, there is no test retard... you just need to provide the results of an accredited IQ test.

Secondly, how did I not comprehend what you were saying. You were saying that we should help those in need with money. I disagree. I think if you want to help people with your money, thats cool. Please don't use mine. I'd rather not pay 30% (or more) of my income in taxes tvm. Especially in light that such a system can not work with ever increasing population and a population which has a large number of people who don;t pay equally (or at all) into the pot. Rather than talking about fucking idealism and a perfect world, why don't you come an live here for more than a decade like I have and make your own damn observations. The government here as already admitted that they can not keep up with demand. Its not a problem of paying it out to people who are "not in need" because 1) they DO qualify as "in need" and 2) It wouldn't work even if we did pay only those "genuinely" in need and not leeching.

Will scan and post.

What are you talking about? Atleast over here in Britain most of the immigrants do a hell of alot better job then the fat lazy natives. Theres exceptions but most of them do work harder than the average native british person. Asylum seekers aren't allowed to work until they become a full citizen which isn't that easy anymore...

I'm talking about the Netherlands, not the UK. I don;t live in the UK nor do I have any knowledge of how their system works.

[Don JoHnson]

There is no test Rtard... you just need to provide the results of an accredited IQ test.

Will scan and post.

so all i have to do is go find a piece of paper, create my own test, win it and send it to them? well last time i checked they had their own tests, but maybe thats a new "dont make the dumb people mad" programm so everyone can have a bumper sticker "im in MENSA".

who knows ....

but please show me your test anyway, i like those things!

[DR.NUMBERS]

so all i have to do is go find a piece of paper, create my own test, win it and send it to them?

who knows ....

but please show me your test anyway, i like those things!


What part of "accredited" do you not understand? And yes, they do also produce their own tests.

[Nasty]

twice? when was the first time and when was the second time?

WWII and then Communism.

IMO without the huge global offensive it would've spread. Communism /= free world.

It would've been much like the third reich - totalitarian regime with oppression, limited individual rights and the obligation to obey the leaders or face prosecution.

Alot of people have a hard time admitting this, but communism would've destroyed the free world as we know it.

[Don JoHnson]

What part of "accredited" do you not understand? And yes, they do also produce their own tests.

no really? they accredit your test before you can join those brainiacs? I thought they just needed some kind of (toilet) paper with a big red 130 in the middle to let you join. but now, that they themself accredit it... wow thats a whole new story than, no really, this makes you really smart.

P.S:: where you great test?

[DR.NUMBERS]

no really? they accredit your test before you can join those brainiacs? I thought they just needed some kind of (toilet) paper with a big red 130 in the middle to let you join. but now, that they themself accredit it... wow thats a whole new story than, no really, this makes you really smart.

P.S:: where you great test?

I'm sorry, I don't speak Pidgin English. "Where you great test?" That depends on what you would classify as "the greatest test": parenthood? courage under fire? self reliance?

Could you rephrase the question?

你会说英语吗？ Nǐ huì shuō Yīngyǔ ma?

我听不懂。 Wǒ tīng bù dǒng.

[Don JoHnson]

WWII and then Communism.

IMO without the huge global offensive it would've spread. Communism /= free world.

It would've been much like the third reich - totalitarian regime with oppression, limited individual rights and the obligation to obey the leaders or face prosecution.

Alot of people have a hard time admitting this, but communism would've destroyed the free world as we know it.

oh they still tell you those lies? interesting.

totalitarian regime like with oppression - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bVa6jn4rpE

limited individual rights like - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaiWCS10C5s

obligation to obey the leaders or face prosecution like - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNLQY3bQyaM


yes, lets all hope that every country becomes like the US and establishes new concentration camps cuz thats the free world we want to see

[Nasty]

No they don't, they just participated in the war, they were one of the ally. Many countries where involved in the ally side, US where just a part of it, a substantial part, but only a part of it. Stupid arrogance is stupid, making poeple think they save the world by themself is utterly wrong and pompous. The world saved itself, US is just a part of it, as much as it were a part of the allies.

Without the US entering the war, the allies would have lost, period. THere is no debate. Some might argue they entered late, but they did enter when it mattered.

Thank the US for that, then for helping rebuild Europe afterwards and then for ridding the world of a growing communist empire.

[Don JoHnson]

I'm sorry, I don't speak Pidgin English. "Where you great test?" That depends on what you would classify as "the greatest test": parenthood? courage under fire? self reliance?

Could you rephrase the question Mr. Wu?

sure:
where's your great test?

seems an IQ of 138 isnt high enough to guess 2 characters and one ' ...

[Don JoHnson]

Without the US entering the war, the allies would have lost, period. THere is no debate. Some might argue they entered late, but they did enter when it mattered.

Thank the US for that, then for helping rebuild Europe afterwards and then for ridding the world of a growing communist empire.

yeah, thanks to the US, thank you for killing old people and kids holding guns. thank you very much! without you ... who knows ... maybe they all would have killed the army which overran their defenses! thx alot!

[DR.NUMBERS]

sure:
where's your great test?

seems an IQ of 138 isnt high enough to guess 2 characters and one ' ...

Seems like a highschool education isn't enough to fully grasp English grammar.

As for your question, I won't be scanning the pages of the test itself as I can't be assed. However, come the morrow I will scan my MENSA card just for you.

[Don JoHnson]

Seems like a highschool education isn't enough to grasp English grammar.

As for question, I won't be scanning the pages of the test itself as I can't be assed. However, come the morrow I will scan my MENSA card just for you.

but im not member of this brainic MENSA club so you could be lieing to me, how should i know this card is real and not fake? everyone can make a simple card!

[Nasty]

oh they still tell you those lies? interesting.

totalitarian regime like with oppression - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bVa6jn4rpE

limited individual rights like - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaiWCS10C5s

obligation to obey the leaders or face prosecution like - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNLQY3bQyaM


yes, lets all hope that every country becomes like the US and establishes new concentration camps cuz thats the free world we want to see

20-30 million dead under Stalin, massive scale forced evictions, state confiscation of property, starvation, poverty, no individual rights, political and racial prosecution, torture and executions en mass. Call it whatever the fuck you want.

The US hunted it down and stoped it from spreading. Despite huge sacrifices of both american, opposition and civilian lives, eventually, american pressure helped force the downfall of the communist powerbase. It no longer poses a threat to the free world.

[DR.NUMBERS]

but im not member of this brainic MENSA club so you could be lieing to me, how should i know this card is real and not fake? everyone can make a simple card!

Well then, you'll never be satisfied will you?

Unless you want to meet me in person and demand satisfaction.

We can each head on down to the community center or a psychologist and square of against one another using standard "accredited" IQ papers.

[Fall]

I smell a huge e-peen battle

[Don JoHnson]

20-30 million dead under Stalin, massive scale forced evictions, state confiscation of property, starvation, poverty, no individual rights, political and racial prosecution, torture and executions en mass. Call it whatever the fuck you want.

The US hunted it down and killed it. It no longer poses a threat to the free world. Job well done, despite huge sacrifices of both american, opposition and civilian lives.

according to:
http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat0.htm

the US killed 20 million native americans alone, without war, with the help of their "free world".
well if beeing part of the US "free world" means that so many people have to die, i dont think there are much ppl who want to be in this "free world".

maybe we should ask those guys in G-Bay what they think of the "free world" especially the first part ... "free"

[Don JoHnson]

Well then, you'll never be satisfied will you?

Unless you want to meet me in person and demand satisfaction.

We can each head on down to the community center or a psychologist and square of against one another using standard "accredited" IQ papers.

or you simply scan your IQ test. i mean, your IQ is "skyrocket high". I mean, wow its 138 its like you are a the reason of a gangbang of einstein, hawkins and da vinci! with that IQ you cant scan a piece of paper?

if thats the case i really dont want to be "that clever"

[Nasty]

according to:
http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat0.htm

the US killed 20 million native americans alone, without war, with the help of their "free world".
well if beeing part of the US "free world" means that so many people have to die, i dont think there are much ppl who want to be in this "free world".

maybe we should ask those guys in G-Bay what they think of the "free world" especially the first part ... "free"

You need to learn how to separate centuries of evolution.

Do you still slam Spain, England, Germany, Portugal, France, Holland, Italy etc for their imperialist eras? Surely they massacred millions of africans, native americans, asians etc.

How about the crusades, either muslim or christian?

How about our viking raids nearly a thousand years ago? How fucking irrelevant isn't that in correlation to current affairs?

I am speaking of the mid-latter part of the 20th century. US for the rescue twice. Learn to lick some sweaty US ballsack for that.

[Don JoHnson]

You need to learn how to separate centuries of evolution.

Do you still slam England, Germany, Portugal, France, Holland, Italy etc for their imperialist eras? Surely they massacred millions of africans, native americans, asians etc.

How about our viking raids nearly a thousand years ago? How fucking irrelevant isn't that in correlation to current affairs?

I am speaking of the mid-latter part of the 20th century. US for the rescue twice. Learn to lick some sweaty US ballsack for that.

ohhhhh im sorry, i didnt know you only want to talk about the bad times of other countrys, so you decide the bad habbits of the US doesnt count because, well it wouldnt fit in your argument, would it.

Sorry, you should have told earlier. i wasnt aware that you just wanted to say
"US racism > other countries racism because US == free world and not US == bad bad communists"

[DR.NUMBERS]

or you simply scan your IQ test. i mean, your IQ is "skyrocket high". I mean, wow its 138 its like you are a the reason of a gangbang of einstein, hawkins and da vinci! with that IQ you cant scan a piece of paper?

if thats the case i really dont want to be "that clever"

OK, again, Pidgin English. I'm afraid you'll have to rephrase that.

From what I can gleam though it appears you believe I am the offspring of a joint Einstein, Hawkings and Da Vinci get together. This only adds your lack of of the understanding of reproduction and knowledge of historical figures and their respective lifespans to my increasingly firm suspicions of your limited intellectual capability and level of education.

It also leads me to believe that you have not yet reproduced or "made it" for which I am eternally grateful. Please thank your parents or school board for not passing on the requisite know-how.

Lastly, you show surprise that, with my level of intelligence, I am some how "unable" to scan a piece of paper. What you fail to comprehend, I assume because you have never had to take such a test, is that it is not "a piece of paper" but rather numerous pieces of paper. So that it is such that I am not "unable" but rather that "I am unwilling".

[Don JoHnson]

OK, again, Pidgin English. I'm afraid you'll have to rephrase that.

From what I can gleam though it appears you believe I am the offspring of a joint Einstein, Hawkings and Da Vinci get together. This only adds your lack of of the understanding of reproduction and knowledge of historical figures and their respective lifespans to my increasingly firm suspicions of your limited intellectual capability and level of education.

It also leads me to believe that you have not yet reproduced or "made it" for which I am eternally grateful. Please thank your parents or school board for not passing on the relevant know-how.

Lastly, you show surprise that, with my level of intelligence, I am some how "unable" to scan a piece of paper. What you fail to comprehend, I assume because you have never had to take such a test, is that it is not "a piece of paper" but numerous pieces of paper. So that it is not that "I am unable" but rather that "I am unwilling".

well, i would be unwiiling too if my results would have been around 85

[Nasty]

ohhhhh im sorry, i didnt know you only want to talk about the bad times of other countrys, so you decide the bad habbits of the US doesnt count because, well it wouldnt fit in your argument, would it.

Sorry, you should have told earlier. i wasnt aware that you just wanted to say
"US racism > other countries racism because US == free world and not US == bad bad communists"

Ok, I will try to slow down the pace, just for you.

You quoted me, asking on which two occations the US had come to the rescue. My answer was WWII and the offensive eventually (indirectly) leading to the downfall of communism. The US saved Europe twice, meanwhile helping it rebuild, which almost counts as 3.

Most europeans are grateful for their freedom.

No doubt the US has also made their fat share of wrongdoings, I'm just pointing out the obvious, that the US has saved Europe twice.

[Don JoHnson]

Ok, I will try to slow down the pace, just for you.

You quoted me, asking on which two occations the US had come to the rescue. My answer was WWII and the offensive eventually (indirectly) leading to the downfall of communism. The US saved Europe twice, meanwhile helping it rebuild, which almost counts as 3.

Most europeans are grateful for their freedom.

so lets keep that speed:
after you said so i told you that US troops didnt save anything, they came when the war was already won. there was no way germany could have made it a win the time US entered it. so the US didnt save europe from the war, and thus didnt save europe from communism(btw who said communism is something bad? if capitalism means creating concentration camps than capitalism is a bad thing, but thats another story)

[Carl Ragadamn]

after you said so i told you that US troops didnt save anything, they came when the war was already won. there was no way germany could have made it a win the time US entered it

If this is true then Europe owes the US 400k soldiers.

[Don JoHnson]

If this is true then Europe owes the US 400k soldiers.

ok let me rephrase this
i walk along the street in the night and see some strangers fight some fight. i join the fight about 5 seconds before the end and get hit, lose some teeth, and than i say "i won this fight now come and pay my doctors bill"

kinda weird dont you think.

[Nasty]

so lets keep that speed:
after you said so i told you that US troops didnt save anything, they came when the war was already won. there was no way germany could have made it a win the time US entered it. so the US didnt save europe from the war, and thus didnt save europe from communism(btw who said communism is something bad? if capitalism means creating concentration camps than capitalism is a bad thing, but thats another story)

They entered the war in 1941. They had also facilitated trade and supplies before that. You have any idea how much the nazis were owning it up in 1941?

Tides turned around late 1942/1943. The US effort mattered alot, although some would argue they should have joined up instantly and not waited for Pearl Harbor and consequential events.

[Carl Ragadamn]

ok let me rephrase this
i walk along the street in the night and see some strangers fight some fight. i join the fight about 5 seconds before the end and get hit, lose some teeth, and than i say "i won this fight now come and pay my doctors bill"

kinda weird dont you think.
It was more like the US came and finished the fight saving the winner from further injury and then said "Here let me help you pay the doctor bill".


Tides turned around late 1942/1943. The US effort mattered alot, although some would argue they should have joined up instantly and not waited for Pearl Harbor and consequential events.

Isolationism is a bitch to get out of, and it may be that the Giant is finding that going back to sleep is not that bad of an idea.

[Desperado[1G]]

so lets keep that speed:
after you said so i told you that US troops didnt save anything, they came when the war was already won. there was no way germany could have made it a win the time US entered it. so the US didnt save europe from the war, and thus didnt save europe from communism(btw who said communism is something bad? if capitalism means creating concentration camps than capitalism is a bad thing, but thats another story)

LOL

You've all been trolled. I refuse to believe someone could actually believe this shit.

[Carl Ragadamn]

;1904952']LOL

You've all been trolled. I refuse to believe someone could actually believe this shit.

No level of stupid surprises me here.

[DR.NUMBERS]

;1904952']LOL

You've all been trolled. I refuse to believe someone could actually believe this shit.

Yeah, I've been becoming very suspicious as well. However, it could be that I have too high a hope for humanity.

[Nasty]

ok let me rephrase this
i walk along the street in the night and see some strangers fight some fight. i join the fight about 5 seconds before the end and get hit, lose some teeth, and than i say "i won this fight now come and pay my doctors bill"

kinda weird dont you think.

More like. you throw a pair of nunchucks and a protein bar to the losing side after observing the fight for a few seconds. Then suddenly the attackers throw a bottle at you, you give a warning while watching the fight commence and then you decide to join in and help smash the attackers.

[Don JoHnson]

They entered the war in 1941. They had also facilitated trade and supplies before that. You have any idea how much the nazis were owning it up in 1941?

Tides turned around late 1942/1943. The US effort mattered alot, although some would argue they should have joined up instantly and not waited for Pearl Harbor and consequential events.

By D-Day, 35% of all German soldiers had been wounded at least once, 11% twice, 6% three times, 2% four times and 2% more than 4 times....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/wwtwo/desperate_measures_07.shtml

[Carl Ragadamn]

By D-Day, 35% of all German soldiers had been wounded at least once, 11% twice, 6% three times, 2% four times and 2% more than 4 times....

No wonder it only took the combined might of the Allied Nations a few weeks to wrap it up.

[Don JoHnson]

No wonder it only took the combined might of the Allied Nations a few weeks to wrap it up.

combined might of allied nations - yes
us was part of it - no

[Polluxo]

Poison. Discretion is always best.

Southerners don't believe in witchcraft.

[Matriel]

Thats a sad attitude you have. Did you know that we get alot more healthcare for our money then you american citizens get for the same amount of money?

Infact, Sweden is the most costeffective country in the world when it comes to healthcare. Our system is way superior yours. Sweden is the number one country in healthcare and it's our taxes that is a part of that number one spot.

Funny how our system was much better before we partly socialized it and fucked it up with regulations like the HMO act. I love how if something government does doesn't work, we have to add more government to make it work. Insanity ftw.

Sweden's system is great if you're poor. My setup is vastly superiour to the Swedish system, but then again I have a job that provides great health care.

[Nasty]

Isolationism is a bitch to get out of, and it may be that the Giant is finding that going back to sleep is not that bad of an idea.

Aye, and some would argue this is partly due to bad decisions being made by its masters, exhausting any will it has to assist in future conflicts. The giant is much needed, but someone made an unwarranted wakeup call at the wrong time for the wrong reasons. Meanwhile the Giant got pickpocketed and embarassed by its own masters.

Slightly offtopic, but:
Saddam was just a powertripping textbook tyrant, I bet he could even have been bought pretty cheap. He fed on money and power.

Sadly, someone needed to settle a personal score and at the same time make a killing in $s, staking thousands of american lives and at the same time triggering the recruitment of terrorists and suicide bombers for another century.

Not saying Iraq was all futile, Saddam did more than enough to warrant a lynching, I'm just saying in this world we live in those dollars could be put to better use elsewhere, whether it would be for global anti-terrorism, US homeland security, or just the odd righteous cause.

[Hecubis]

No wonder it only took the combined might of the Allied Nations a few weeks to wrap it up.

Huh? It took about a year.

[DR.NUMBERS]

Southerners don't believe in witchcraft.

Voodoo? Not quite the same, but they share practices.

[Kietharr]

US saved Europe, all of continental Europe fell to the Nazis or was decidedly neutral, some nations even collaborating with them. We entered the war early on and proceeded to fight a two front war starting out with a second rate military.

Of course, as history tells, we out produced and out fought everyone else, kicking the shit out of two fronts at once and quickly building the strongest military in the world. We turned the tide of the war, we were essential in D-Day, the Brits and Canucks wouldn't have done it without us, and we wouldn't have done it without them.

A great many things may be said about WWII, but saying that the US wasn't important in the war is an outright lie and deception.

[Nasty]

Sweden's system is great if you're poor. My setup is vastly superiour to the Swedish system, but then again I have a job that provides great health care.

We have a competing private healthcare sector here (thinking they do in Sweden too) that is available if you can pay, or, have the gov pay for if you can somehow argue their services are better fit for you than the public.

I generally agree though, I am for privatizing, or at least making it competitive.

[Jathen]

My favorite part about last night was the idiot blacks running around outside my dorm in a big group chanting Obamas name. Like he is actually going to change something for them...

[Matriel]

US saved Europe, all of continental Europe fell to the Nazis or was decidedly neutral, some nations even collaborating with them. We entered the war early on and proceeded to fight a two front war starting out with a second rate military.

Of course, as history tells, we out produced and out fought everyone else, kicking the shit out of two fronts at once and quickly building the strongest military in the world. We turned the tide of the war, we were essential in D-Day, the Brits and Canucks wouldn't have done it without us, and we wouldn't have done it without them.

A great many things may be said about WWII, but saying that the US wasn't important in the war is an outright lie and deception.

Some historians make the argument that Russia could have taken Europe on her own once she got steamrolling. I disagree personally considering the amount of supplies we gave them. And Khrushchev personally writing in his memoirs that they would not have survived without spam was the nail in the coffin to that theory in my book. However, I don't think we were the super shining knight our version of the history has made us out to be.

[Matriel]

We have a competing private healthcare sector here (thinking they do in Sweden too) that is available if you can pay, or, have the gov pay for if you can somehow argue their services are better fit for you than the public.

I generally agree though, I am for privatizing, or at least making it competitive.

Sure, but in that case you're stuck paying for the public system while privately paying private out of your pocket. In essence buying health care twice.

My public costs are just rolled into my initial payment and that total is far less than I would pay in a public system. At least based upon comparisons between our tax laws in my demographic.

If the US "plan" can be done without raising costs to me, then by all means yay. I just don't see it happening.

[Hecubis]

US saved Europe, all of continental Europe fell to the Nazis or was decidedly neutral, some nations even collaborating with them. We entered the war early on and proceeded to fight a two front war starting out with a second rate military.

Of course, as history tells, we out produced and out fought everyone else, kicking the shit out of two fronts at once and quickly building the strongest military in the world. We turned the tide of the war, we were essential in D-Day, the Brits and Canucks wouldn't have done it without us, and we wouldn't have done it without them.

A great many things may be said about WWII, but saying that the US wasn't important in the war is an outright lie and deception.

Well the Russians actually did the lions share of the fighting against Nazi Germany. The Western front was a side show compared to the eastern front.

The US was important (as was like half the fucking planet who fought against the Germans), but ultimately it was the Soviets who played the biggest role in the demise of the Third Reich.

On the other hand though, the USA saved Europe from the Bolsheviks. If it wasn't for the quick development of nuclear weapons by the USA, the Red Army would just have kept marching right past Berlin and would have taken the whole shebang.

[Nasty]

Sure, but in that case you're stuck paying for the public system while privately paying private out of your pocket. In essence buying health care twice.

My public costs are just rolled into my initial payment and that total is far less than I would pay in a public system. At least based upon comparisons between our tax laws in my demographic.

If the US "plan" can be done without raising costs to me, then by all means yay. I just don't see it happening.

Yeah, we're paying to get rid of any guilty conscience.

Sadly, the leeches are growing in numbers and you actually see taxpayers backed up corridors just to have worthless pieces of shit treated first. That's the reality of a supply and demand imbalance. We don't have a private sector capable of overlapping every specialist field, just some.

It's not that bad, but the outlook of it eventually backfiring on the decent citizens who have spent their lives taxpaying for leeches is very real.

My dad works both the public and private sector as a doc and the workload they get pushed on them in the public sector is ridiculous. Unfortunately for him, he's the humane kind who would rather keep a clean conscience and offer his services to the public than make a killing at a high salary private hospital, domestic or foreign.

[Don JoHnson]

US saved Europe, all of continental Europe fell to the Nazis or was decidedly neutral, some nations even collaborating with them. We entered the war early on and proceeded to fight a two front war starting out with a second rate military.

Of course, as history tells, we out produced and out fought everyone else, kicking the shit out of two fronts at once and quickly building the strongest military in the world. We turned the tide of the war, we were essential in D-Day, the Brits and Canucks wouldn't have done it without us, and we wouldn't have done it without them.

A great many things may be said about WWII, but saying that the US wasn't important in the war is an outright lie and deception.

that really sounds great, and the movies made about this are great too. even the books written about this are interesting to read.
but they all have one thing in common: they wont make it true. i know the US ego of "we are the shiny knights, we fight for freedom we are the good all others are bad" is deep within your heart. but regarding WW2 it is simply not true and never was.

there is no way i can prove this point but there is no way you can prove yours, all i can tell you is go read some books and draw your own conclusions.

It is true that it was a good decision not to depart everything like the russions did, but germany would not have won the war if the US stayed neutral

[DR.NUMBERS]

Some historians make the argument that Russia could have taken Europe on her own once she got steamrolling. I disagree personally considering the amount of supplies we gave them. And Khrushchev personally writing in his memoirs that they would not have survived without spam was the nail in the coffin to that theory in my book. However, I don't think we were the super shining knight our version of the history has made us out to be.

Indeed, the Russians (or their climate) caused far and away the greatest number of German casualties. However, by the end of the war they were totally spent, both economically and militarily and their manpower was stretched.

However, the US played a crucial role in supply though for virtually every allied nation. Especially with regards to fuel, food and tanks. By the end of 1941 Britain was faced with a chronic shortage of food and fuel and would have been starved out of the war without US aid.

As an aside, if I recall correctly, on D-day the majority of Axis defenders were in fact not German but "Ost" units, a mixture of many of Eastern European nationalities, notably Georgian, Armenian, Polish and Russian.

[Matriel]

Yeah, we're paying to get rid of any guilty conscience.

Sadly, the leeches are growing in numbers and you actually see taxpayers backed up corridors just to have worthless pieces of shit treated first. That's the reality of a supply and demand imbalance. We don't have a private sector capable of overlapping every specialist field, just some.

It's not that bad, but the outlook of it eventually backfiring on the decent citizens who have spent their lives taxpaying for leeches is very real.

My dad works both the public and private sector as a doc and the workload they get pushed on them in the public sector is ridiculous. Unfortunately for him, he's the humane kind who would rather keep a clean conscience and offer his services to the public than make a killing at a high salary private hospital, domestic or foreign.

Sounds like a self-imposed guilty conscience. Give money to charity. Knowing that I'm giving to an organization of my own free will that's actually efficient is a good feeling normally.

[DR.NUMBERS]

Sounds like a self-imposed guilty conscience. Give money to charity. Knowing that I'm giving to an organization of my own free will that's actually efficient is a good feeling normally.

That's my take personally, or get involved with local efforts like community house building.

[Mushukyou]

My favorite part about last night was the idiot blacks running around outside my dorm in a big group chanting Obamas name. Like he is actually going to change something for them...

The dude is half black... get a full black person in there and then they can run around and be stupid.

[Nasty]

Sounds like a self-imposed guilty conscience. Give money to charity. Knowing that I'm giving to an organization of my own free will that's actually efficient is a good feeling normally.

I agree. I believe in choice too. Charity is a good thing. Although the traditition isn't as strong here as in the US, most decent people with the wallet to back it donate money to various charities.

[ColonelTEE3]

I think its ridiculous how many people are focused on how well he speaks.

You can talk about dog shit in a pretty eloquent manner with enough practice and rehearsal and maybe enough drugs, but that doesn't change the fact that your still talking about dog shit.

Today in my first class at my university, one of my peers was very emotional about the election but she never once said 'im so glad his tax plan is going into effect', the only thing she ever mentioned was 'im so excited a black president got elected!'.

I had to restrain myself from walking over to her and punching her right the hell off her chair. It disgusts me how many people voted for Obama because he would be Americas first black president, or that he can talk about issues much more enthusiastically than McCain. It doesn't change the fact that he's going to turn America into a new god damned socialist nation.

[Don JoHnson]

I think its ridiculous how many people are focused on how well he speaks.

You can talk about dog shit in a pretty eloquent manner with enough practice and rehearsal and maybe enough drugs, but that doesn't change the fact that your still talking about dog shit.

Today in my first class at my university, one of my peers was very emotional about the election but she never once said 'im so glad his tax plan is going into effect', the only thing she ever mentioned was 'im so excited a black president got elected!'.

I had to restrain myself from walking over to her and punching her right the hell off her chair. It disgusts me how many people voted for Obama because he would be Americas first black president, or that he can talk about issues much more enthusiastically than McCain. It doesn't change the fact that he's going to turn America into a new god damned socialist nation.

c'mon lets face the truth: which one would you prefer as president:

Someone talking like obama or someone talking like

i speak with god. god say me who bad people. i kill bad people

[Beeblebrox]

United forever in friendship and labour,
Our mighty republics will ever endure.
The great Soviet Union will live through the ages.
The dream of a people their fortress secure.

CHORUS:
Long live our Soviet Motherland, built by the people's mighty hand.
Long live our People, united and free.
Strong in our friendship tried by fire. Long may our crimson flag inspire,
Shining in glory for all men to see.

Through days dark and stormy where Great Lenin led us
Our eyes saw the bright sun of freedom above
and Stalin our Leader with faith in the People,
Inspired us to build up the land that we love.

CHORUS:
Long live our Soviet Motherland, built by the people's mighty hand.
Long live our People, united and free.
Strong in our friendship tried by fire. Long may our crimson flag inspire,
Shining in glory for all men to see.

We fought for the future, destroyed the invader,
and brought to our homeland the Laurels of Fame.
Our glory will live in the memory of nations
and all generations will honour her name.

CHORUS:
Long live our Soviet Motherland, built by the people's mighty hand.
Long live our People, united and free.
Strong in our friendship tried by fire. Long may our crimson flag inspire,
Shining in glory for all men to see.




ROCK ON!!!

[Mushukyou]

I think its ridiculous how many people are focused on how well he speaks.

You can talk about dog shit in a pretty eloquent manner with enough practice and rehearsal and maybe enough drugs, but that doesn't change the fact that your still talking about dog shit.

Today in my first class at my university, one of my peers was very emotional about the election but she never once said 'im so glad his tax plan is going into effect', the only thing she ever mentioned was 'im so excited a black president got elected!'.

I had to restrain myself from walking over to her and punching her right the hell off her chair. It disgusts me how many people voted for Obama because he would be Americas first black president, or that he can talk about issues much more enthusiastically than McCain. It doesn't change the fact that he's going to turn America into a new god damned socialist nation.

Yup, I feel the same way about the way people just want to elect him because he's "black". He's only half black, by the way - yet they say he's black. Weird and stupid.

In any case, national healthcare would be GREAT for this country. Your socialist conclusion is a bit extreme.

We've "socialized" the Police and Fire... you're not complaining there?

[Matriel]

We've "socialized" the Police and Fire... you're not complaining there?

They are done at local levels and tend to work somewhat okay. Organizations like the FBI tend to be big sprawling inefficient cesspools. Hell, only like 50% (number is probably off, don't feel like looking up the exact percentage on the fbi crime statistics page) of murders are solved. If that doesn't tell you something, nothing will.

Or the War on Drugs for that matter. Something like an 80 billion budget and drug use has increased.

[stem589]

I saw the assassination play out like 20 times in my mind throughout that speech. I feel the bulletproof glass was legit.



Oh man……. that’s bad mojo.

If you and I had the same thoughts, you gotta know there’s a lot of people thinking the same thing.

I can’t even begin to imagine the fallout from something like that.

[Beorg]

Pretty epic, even if you don't align with him ideologically.

The man has got some serious speaking skills. He even seems authentic. Reminds of the old school US presidents who were visionaries and not just hardened career politicians.

PS, I vote far right libertarian in my country and I hate taxes. I share your pain on certain domestic issues, but I still think he is the best candidate for the overall benefit of the US. (apart from RP)

Aye, I've talked to several people at work and asked them what they think about Obama, most say they like him, just not some of his tax plans. The Death tax for instance--under Obama the Death tax may rise to 25 or 30%. There are a few other small things, but most still said they would rather vote for him than McCain.

Others are still clinging to McCain, and are saying that somehow Obama's voters only voted for him due to his race, and so they wouldn't be called racists...piss-poor excuse.

[Fro]

By D-Day, 35% of all German soldiers had been wounded at least once, 11% twice, 6% three times, 2% four times and 2% more than 4 times....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/wwtwo/desperate_measures_07.shtml

I'm gonna side with the fucking yanks on this one. Americans were involved in alot more than D-day fool.

US saved Europe, all of continental Europe fell to the Nazis or was decidedly neutral, some nations even collaborating with them. We entered the war early on and proceeded to fight a two front war starting out with a second rate military.

Of course, as history tells, we out produced and out fought everyone else, kicking the shit out of two fronts at once and quickly building the strongest military in the world. We turned the tide of the war, we were essential in D-Day, the Brits and Canucks wouldn't have done it without us, and we wouldn't have done it without them.

A great many things may be said about WWII, but saying that the US wasn't important in the war is an outright lie and deception.
America helped a great deal but Russia had it covered.

[Polluxo]

Oh man……. that’s bad mojo.

If you and I had the same thoughts, you gotta know there’s a lot of people thinking the same thing.

I can’t even begin to imagine the fallout from something like that.

Crap, you guys saw it too? That only means one thing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lt7o8k1DAHM

7 days left...

[Mushukyou]

They are done at local levels and tend to work somewhat okay. Organizations like the FBI tend to be big sprawling inefficient cesspools. Hell, only like 50% (number is probably off, don't feel like looking up the exact percentage on the fbi crime statistics page) of murders are solved. If that doesn't tell you something, nothing will.

Or the War on Drugs for that matter. Something like an 80 billion budget and drug use has increased.

The war on drugs is stupid and should stop.
We should legalize the shit.

Well, we should somehow localize the healthcare then, in much the same way. The government/state will pay. Works for me.

[Matriel]

America helped a great deal but Russia had it covered.

Lend-Lease. 45% of their copper.

The war on drugs is stupid and should stop.
We should legalize the shit.

Well, we should somehow localize the healthcare then, in much the same way. The government/state will pay. Works for me.

I always said taxes should be reversed. Most to local, same to state, little to Federal. Then shit would probably work a lot better. Unless you live in Compton or something.