MMORPG not MMOFPS

[JackyD]

Character progression through skill improvement and gear progression are fundamental parts of role playing games also referred to as RPG! Now here comes the trick: Darkfall will, according to the Devs, be an RPG too and therefore both aforementioned parts will be implemented and they will play a big role when it comes to how your character performs.

If you don't want these elements in a game then maybe the RPG segment of the MMO market isn't the right one for you? Maybe you should wait for a company to release "Counterstrike World" or something alike but pls stop fucking up RPG games where the major points of the games are roleplaying somebody/thing else and character progression.

I don't know where most of you come from but I come from pen and paper RPGs and have always seen MMORPG as the same just on a larger scale, hell that was the most excitment for me not being restricted to RP only with my closest friends but with ppl from all over the world.

The only downside I always found in these game was the lvl of restrictedness there was and I'm glad that there finally will be an RPG that allows full freedom gameplay (I sadly never had the possibility to play old UO as I had no PC or internets until late 1999 and didn't hear about MMORPGs until 2001).

Now 7 years after my first online gaming experience there finally comes a RPG that offers nearly full freedom coupled with territorial conquest and what I seem to hear the most are complaints about the basics of RPGs?

Oh and to those that like to call me carebear go ahead just think about this: If I were the Devs than the game had perma death just as in good old pen and paper RPGs, but I guess you were too carebear to play those?

[verlox2]

uhhh....ok?

[Xzi]

Who suggested Darkfall is an MMOFPS? I'm definitely looking forward to the character development aspects of the game.

[OvanOf Twilight]

Who suggested Darkfall is an MMOFPS? I'm definitely looking forward to the character development aspects of the game.

About 1/8 of Forumfall basically thinks of it as pure PvP and nothing else. -.-

[Wrafe]

YAY!!!

Why are you telling the general public this, btw?

[Shaehl]

What's your point newb? Everyone knows this. Darkfall has this. Aventurine just implements these facets of RPGness in superior and innovative ways.

Gear is a factor. Character skill is a factor. It's just that player skill is the biggest factor.

[Chubbyjesus]

Cocaine is a helluva drug.

[Xzi]

About 1/8 of Forumfall basically thinks of it as pure PvP and nothing else. -.-
And 90% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

[OvanOf Twilight]

And 90% of all statistics are made up on the spot.

87%

[Xzi]

87%
99%

[DefaultUserName]

I don't really know if I understand your post. Are you saying that a lot of people are complaining about the Role Playing aspect of the game? If that's the case then I haven't really seen this much at all. In fact, I would think that being first-person is a much better way to role play since you are literally seeing everything through the eyes of your character.

If I am way off base here then please disregard my post.

[Reichsdiener]

than the game had perma death just as in good old pen and paper RPGs

oh, sweet beloved memories...

[Shaehl]

99%

Actually, sir, it's 76%. Also, 4/3 of people are bad at math.

[JackyD]

As some are asking why I'm posting this:

When reading these forums and skimming through the polls and the replies to them most of the people posting here give me the impression that they expect Darkfall to become something more akin to an FPS and some even seem to want all RPG removed from the game. So I wanted to point out my thoughts about this and get some general feedback from forumfall on that topic.

[GrayGhost79]

Character progression through skill improvement and gear progression are fundamental parts of role playing games also referred to as RPG! Now here comes the trick: Darkfall will, according to the Devs, be an RPG too and therefore both aforementioned parts will be implemented and they will play a big role when it comes to how your character performs.

If you don't want these elements in a game then maybe the RPG segment of the MMO market isn't the right one for you? Maybe you should wait for a company to release "Counterstrike World" or something alike but pls stop fucking up RPG games where the major points of the games are roleplaying somebody/thing else and character progression.

I don't know where most of you come from but I come from pen and paper RPGs and have always seen MMORPG as the same just on a larger scale, hell that was the most excitment for me not being restricted to RP only with my closest friends but with ppl from all over the world.

The only downside I always found in these game was the lvl of restrictedness there was and I'm glad that there finally will be an RPG that allows full freedom gameplay (I sadly never had the possibility to play old UO as I had no PC or internets until late 1999 and didn't hear about MMORPGs until 2001).

Now 7 years after my first online gaming experience there finally comes a RPG that offers nearly full freedom coupled with territorial conquest and what I seem to hear the most are complaints about the basics of RPGs?

Oh and to those that like to call me carebear go ahead just think about this: If I were the Devs than the game had perma death just as in good old pen and paper RPGs, but I guess you were too carebear to play those?


Well welcome to MMORPG's. DarkFall is an MMORPG/FPS it's a combo deal. Player Skill is going to play a larger part than gear/items ect which is a good thing. I come from Pen and Paper RPG's as well from D&D to alot of White Wolf stuff as well as MMORPG's Starting with Ultima Online. One of the kewl things about a pen and paper RPG was that you could defeat that wizard with the orb of dragon kind may not always happen but the possibilty existed. MMORPG's haven't been like this if I had an Orb of Dragon Kind in any average MMORPG and you didn't guess what..... I win. With that said as far as the PvP well it's a package deal with freedom. So in closing Welcome to MMORPG's and DarkFall if your not wanting PvP or FPS style combat DarkFall just might not be for you there are plenty of other MMORPG's out there and yes one or 2 even does have perma death unless they changed that aspect of it.

[robtb]

What's your point newb? Everyone knows this. Darkfall has this. Aventurine just implements these facets of RPGness in superior and innovative ways.

Gear is a factor. Character skill is a factor. It's just that player skill is the biggest factor.

Clearly your not on the same forums I am. OP has it right and for the 3 years i've been here i'm surprised I still see people who don't know what their looking for out of each genre of gaming. He'll i've seen countless posts that try to compare Darkfall with Gunz as if Gunz were an mmorpg, arguments that suggest its not an fps unless one can go prone, and the most stupid criticisms can be seen surrounding the universal bank debate and how supposedly no one would play if it was based on a local bank system.

People already replying to this post seem to think this games skill is going to depend on one's fps twitch skill. Its not. The twitchplay surrounding a crosshair use is going to be far less important in a fight than:
-complementary skill builds
-use of crowd control
-use of healing
-use of buffing
-use of collision tactics
-gear statistics
We wont be playing the latest fps with numerous hitboxes requring precision with ones mouse, the hardest twitch skill is going to be leading one's shots for slow traveling spells and play Tribes if you want to practice that, not CS.

What makes fps's hard is it requires intense focus to notice blips that are people, an intuitive battle perception of where people will be, and fast mouse movement because one has milliseconds to get a headshot before his enemy does. Darkfall will not have any of these defining combat as battles will be drawn out by rpg statistics.

[Jayaris]

Hey guys, I think this is a troll thread!

Edit : You could play Combat Arms if you want to play an MMOFPS, though the games are instanced and its a maximum of 16 players so you may aswell just be playing a regular FPS.

MMORTSFPRPG

[JackyD]

Well welcome to MMORPG's. DarkFall is an MMORPG/FPS it's a combo deal. Player Skill is going to play a larger part than gear/items ect which is a good thing. I come from Pen and Paper RPG's as well from D&D to alot of White Wolf stuff as well as MMORPG's Starting with Ultima Online. One of the kewl things about a pen and paper RPG was that you could defeat that wizard with the orb of dragon kind may not always happen but the possibilty existed. MMORPG's haven't been like this if I had an Orb of Dragon Kind in any average MMORPG and you didn't guess what..... I win. With that said as far as the PvP well it's a package deal with freedom. So in closing Welcome to MMORPG's and DarkFall if your not wanting PvP or FPS style combat DarkFall just might not be for you there are plenty of other MMORPG's out there and yes one or 2 even does have perma death unless they changed that aspect of it.

I have no problem with the more "twitch" oriented gameplay, I even welcome it. And I'm not really complaining, just wanted to make a point to all those that cry for skills & gear not to have any effect on your character's performance that they prolly will be badly surprised when they get to play the game and realise that JackVet who's all decked out and has his skills maxed will have an ez game JoeNub who just logged his char in for the 1st time.

[Xzi]

Clearly your not on the same forums I am. OP has it right and for the 3 years i've been here i'm surprised I still see people who don't know what their looking for out of each genre of gaming. He'll i've seen countless posts that try to compare Darkfall with Gunz as if Gunz were an mmorpg, arguments that suggest its not an fps unless one can go prone, and the most stupid criticisms can be seen surrounding the universal bank debate and how supposedly no one would play if it was based on a local bank system.

People already replying to this post seem to think this games skill is going to depend on one's fps twitch skill. Its not. The twitchplay surrounding a crosshair use is going to be far less important in a fight than:
-complementary skill builds
-use of crowd control
-use of healing
-use of buffing
-use of collision tactics
-gear statistics
We wont be playing the latest fps with numerous hitboxes requring precision with ones mouse, the hardest skill is going to be leading one's shots for slow traveling spells and play Tribes if you want to practice that, not CS.
All of those things will be factors in determining the results of each fight ALONG with FPS-twitch skill. If you can't aim worth crap you're never going to kill anyone. Therefore, assuming this won't be a big factor is just stupid.

[OvanOf Twilight]

Actually, sir, it's 76%. Also, 4/3 of people are bad at math.

No it is actually 82%.

[Blodpls]

What features are you referring to?

I'm not particularly into RP but I haven't seen people knocking it and am not against it as it adds flavor to the game.

Can you be more specific?

[Reichsdiener]

As some are asking why I'm posting this:

When reading these forums and skimming through the polls and the replies to them most of the people posting here give me the impression that they expect Darkfall to become something more akin to an FPS and some even seem to want all RPG removed from the game. So I wanted to point out my thoughts about this and get some general feedback from forumfall on that topic.

I know what you mean. You should be a bit wary though, some of the immediate gameplay might seem very non-RP-esque and might mock your RP-heart at first.

However, it is the same lack of restrictions that not only makes for awesome gameplay, but also for sheer unlimited RP-possibilities, so you should bite through the "weird-feeling" when first engaging in the FPS-style combat.

Personally, I'll love kicking ass and getting my ass kicked in first-person hardcore combat and RP the shit out of the game inbetween the slaughters. I've always found it weird that people think you're speaking an entire sermon or singing an opera while you're trying to not get killed by that guy with the pointy stick in front of you. (edit: Which happens in Pen&Paper, you're too busy not getting your ass perma-killed to make up a poem to babble while you're fighting, lulz)

Also, the dude a few posts higher is right, the majority is here for the endless gankfest, doh.

[Unfriendly]

I have no problem with the more "twitch" oriented gameplay, I even welcome it. And I'm not really complaining, just wanted to make a point to all those that cry for skills & gear not to have any effect on your character's performance that they prolly will be badly surprised when they get to play the game and realise that JackVet who's all decked out and has his skills maxed will have an ez game JoeNub who just logged his char in for the 1st time.

What people are crying about is that we want JoeNub to stand a chance.
how the fuck is that so hard to understand?

[Shaehl]

Clearly your not on the same forums I am. OP has it right and for the 3 years i've been here i'm surprised I still see people who don't know what their looking for out of each genre of gaming. He'll i've seen countless posts that try to compare Darkfall with Gunz as if Gunz were an mmorpg, arguments that suggest its not an fps unless one can go prone, and the most stupid criticisms can be seen surrounding the universal bank debate and how supposedly no one would play if it was based on a local bank system.

People already replying to this post seem to think this games skill is going to depend on one's fps twitch skill. Its not. The twitchplay surrounding a crosshair use is going to be far less important in a fight than:
-complementary skill builds
-use of crowd control
-use of healing
-use of buffing
-use of collision tactics
-gear statistics
We wont be playing the latest fps with numerous hitboxes requring precision with ones mouse, the hardest twitch skill is going to be leading one's shots for slow traveling spells and play Tribes if you want to practice that, not CS.

What makes fps's hard is it requires intense focus to notice blips that are people, an intuitive battle perception of where people will be, and fast mouse movement because one has milliseconds to get a headshot before his enemy does. Darkfall will not have any of these defining combat as battles will be drawn out by rpg statistics.

Managing all those things is simply part of being a skilled twitch-player. In some circles it is known as strategy and tactics: being situationally aware and utilizing the tools available to you to the best of your ability. The devs have said themselves that a several fresh-out-of-the-oven newbs could take a gimped out veteran if they work together well and have superior player skill.

That would not be possible if FPS style combat skills were not important.

[Realbigdeal22]

MMORPGFPS thats it.

[robtb]

All of those things will be factors in determining each fight ALONG with FPS-twitch skill. If you can't aim worth crap you're never going to kill anyone. Therefore, assuming this won't be a big factor is just stupid.

Yes if you have down syndrome and can't get past the baby stage learning curve of fps games this game is not for you. Whats being referred to is the fact that player skill will not differ significantly in this respect as there is a low barrier to how meaningful one's twitch fps skill can transfer to this game. Amazing COD4 players put up against less than average COD4 players will find their fight being determined by every factor except their fps skill as they will both have adequate skills to compete in that department given that Darkfall isn't demanding on the crosshair-based twitch side of gaming.

[GrayGhost79]

Clearly your not on the same forums I am. OP has it right and for the 3 years i've been here i'm surprised I still see people who don't know what their looking for out of each genre of gaming. He'll i've seen countless posts that try to compare Darkfall with Gunz as if Gunz were an mmorpg, arguments that suggest its not an fps unless one can go prone, and the most stupid criticisms can be seen surrounding the universal bank debate and how supposedly no one would play if it was based on a local bank system.

People already replying to this post seem to think this games skill is going to depend on one's fps twitch skill. Its not. The twitchplay surrounding a crosshair use is going to be far less important in a fight than:
-complementary skill builds
-use of crowd control
-use of healing
-use of buffing
-use of collision tactics
-gear statistics
We wont be playing the latest fps with numerous hitboxes requring precision with ones mouse, the hardest skill is going to be leading one's shots for slow traveling spells and play Tribes if you want to practice that, not CS.

http://hem.bredband.net/mongobash/DF-FAQ/combatfaq.htm

You are correct somewhat. It is still an MMORPG. Ranged attacks and spells require FP mode. Combat will be twitch combat. There is no lock on or auto attack. These things have already been stated repeatedly. Dev's already have said as well a char freshly created still has a chance to defeat a char thats a year old if they have better player skills. Be glad this isn't more item based and focuses mainly on skill since it is full loot. Not saying items won't give you some advantage but not enough to compensate for your actual playing skill. Active Blocking, Parry (Not sure if it's still in) no lock on no auto attack... Why would you think it isn't going to be twitch combat? With equaly skilled players first to make a mistake looses regardless of gear.

"People already replying to this post seem to think this games skill is going to depend on one's fps twitch skill. Its not. The twitchplay surrounding a crosshair use is going to be far less important in a fight than:
-complementary skill builds
-use of crowd control
-use of healing
-use of buffing
-use of collision tactics
-gear statistics"

Wanted to comment on this again. Already been said by dev's a re-said many times a newly made char can take out a char that has supperior armor.items and char skills if there playing skills are better. There's an actual quote somewhere about Player Skill % and Gear % player skill was a much larger % it's somewhere lol but I don't feel like looking for it atm.

[Vertisce]

Seems to me the OP doesn't understand what MMORPG means. Lets break it down. First M = Massive. DF qualifies as it is indeed massive. Second M = Multiplayer. I think we all agree that DF is a multiplayer game. O = Online. DF doesn't seem to be an offline game to me so...moving on. R = Role and P = Playing...combine them for Role playing. In DF you assume the role of a character and you play him or her in that role. Works well right? G = Game. We all know DF is a game...at least most of us do. So there you go. DF is an MMORPG with FPS characteristics in it. It was bound to happen eventually.

[GrayGhost79]

I have no problem with the more "twitch" oriented gameplay, I even welcome it. And I'm not really complaining, just wanted to make a point to all those that cry for skills & gear not to have any effect on your character's performance that they prolly will be badly surprised when they get to play the game and realise that JackVet who's all decked out and has his skills maxed will have an ez game JoeNub who just logged his char in for the 1st time.

Well I just responded to someone else that said something similar. I doubt they will be overly surprised since the Dev's have said that Player Skill is going to player a larger roll than gear ect. They also said that a newly made char can take out a long established char if there playing skills were better. So it's a bit of a mute point.

[robtb]

Managing all those things is simply part of being a skilled twitch-player. In some circles it is known as strategy and tactics: being situationally aware and utilizing the tools available to you to the best of your ability. The devs have said themselves that a several fresh-out-of-the-oven newbs could take a gimped out veteran if they work together well and have superior player skill.

That would not be possible if FPS style combat skills were not important.

Then one just has a misunderstanding of the OP's definition of the term fps combat (his interpretation being based on the demographic hes responding to on the forum). Those are staple aspects of mmo combat, aside from a very few fps's out there, the majority aim to keep the number of styles of combat minimal and emphasise a player's situational awareness and his precision, not his ability to use additional game tools that affect non-hp related statistics of another player while mmorpgs have been based entirely around debuffing, crowd control, and healing.

[JackyD]

What people are crying about is that we want JoeNub to stand a chance.
how the fuck is that so hard to understand?

Attention RL analogy inc:

Ok so you tell me that when i.e. a new army recruit, with no prior combat training, would go up against his drill instructor he should stand a chance to win against him in a bare handed fight?

Lol no thx, try again.

[JackyD]

Well I just responded to someone else that said something similar. I doubt they will be overly surprised since the Dev's have said that Player Skill is going to player a larger roll than gear ect. They also said that a newly made char can take out a long established char if there playing skills were better. So it's a bit of a mute point.

The Dev quote actually says that a full fledged Vet could stand his own against 4-5 toons fresh outta the box, look it up it's on warcry I think

[Jayaris]

Ok so you tell me that when i.e. a new army recruit, with no prior combat training, would go up against his drill instructor he should stand a chance to win against him in a bare handed fight?


You start with a sword, and I am assuming veteran player is packing some sort of weapon.. I think your analogy is flawed.

[JackyD]

You start with a sword, and I am assuming veteran player is packing some sort of weapon.. I think your analogy is flawed.

then give both' em swords and let's pretend we're in the medieval times for accuracy's sake, that won't change the outcome tho.

Anybody else who wants to go nitpicking?

[Jayaris]

then give both' em swords and let's pretend we're in the medieval times for accuracy's sake, that won't change the outcome tho.

Anybody else who wants to go nitpicking?

That's not true, I might get lucky and stab him. I mean c'mon its clear you are like retarded in the brain. Maybe you should just ignore Acronyms so as not to rage out like you're doing now..

[robtb]

Wanted to comment on this again. Already been said by dev's a re-said many times a newly made char can take out a char that has supperior armor.items and char skills if there playing skills are better. There's an actual quote somewhere about Player Skill % and Gear % player skill was a much larger % it's somewhere lol but I don't feel like looking for it atm.

EDIT: someone already corrected you on your quote.

Gear has to play a solid factor in this game or else what is the point of having a land control pvp game if theres no incentive to fight over the worthwhile resources for gear building. This isnt a 16 on 16 fps match, there needs to be incentive to lock down the best territories, and to maintain income/resources acquisition to fuel war machines.

[Reichsdiener]

The Dev quote actually says that a full fledged Vet could stand his own against 4-5 toons fresh outta the box, look it up it's on warcry I think

Yes, but compare that to an EQ-model game where a character on max level could literally kill unlimited amounts of lvl1 characters.

Big difference there already!!

[Jayaris]

Gear has to play a solid factor in this game or else what is the point of having a land control pvp game if theres no incentive to fight over the worthwhile resources for gear building. This isnt a 16 on 16 fps match, there needs to be incentive to lock down the best territories, and to maintain income/resources acquisition to fuel war machines.

No it doesn't, not having resources will mean you'll run out of mediocre gear let alone hard crafted gear you need resources if you want to throw hundreds of sets of equipment at trying to capture a town. Not to mention ship building or building siege weapons or even building things for your own cities. I really don't think having purples will encourage people to try and land grab more..

[GrayGhost79]

EDIT: someone already corrected you on your quote.

Gear has to play a solid factor in this game or else what is the point of having a land control pvp game if theres no incentive to fight over the worthwhile resources for gear building. This isnt a 16 on 16 fps match, there needs to be incentive to lock down the best territories, and to maintain income/resources acquisition to fuel war machines.

Looking for it now Dev's have said a new player can beat a veteran player if his skill is better Player skills.

[Unfriendly]

Attention RL analogy inc:

Ok so you tell me that when i.e. a new army recruit, with no prior combat training, would go up against his drill instructor he should stand a chance to win against him in a bare handed fight?

Lol no thx, try again.

your way: drill instructor wins every time, not because he uses his environment to his advantage, has better aim, or better timing... no he wins because recruit hits him for 1 damage and gets hit for 50 damage (whatever)
if they fought 5000 times then instructor would win 5000 times
RECRUIT HAS NO CHANCE WHATSOEVER OF WINNING

my way: drill instructor should win every time, because he uses his environment to his advantage, has better aim, and better timing... he still has to fight though.. the game does not simply give him the victory and if recruit is good (player skill) HE MIGHT WIN


maybe that will help you get the fucking point... I doubt it though

[Jreed]

made my account to say I 110% agree with your post. After looking over the board it seems everyone has the same idea of how this game is going to me twitch/skill bases.

When the devs say SKILL, i don't think they are talking about twitch skill. But the skills that you LEVEL UP, ei. swordplay, blocking,axes ect.

I swear this board is filled with the same SKILL bs that the AOC forum was filled with, tons of morons talking about how it's gonna be so /skill/ based when really they have no idea what they are talking about

Clearly your not on the same forums I am. OP has it right and for the 3 years i've been here i'm surprised I still see people who don't know what their looking for out of each genre of gaming. He'll i've seen countless posts that try to compare Darkfall with Gunz as if Gunz were an mmorpg, arguments that suggest its not an fps unless one can go prone, and the most stupid criticisms can be seen surrounding the universal bank debate and how supposedly no one would play if it was based on a local bank system.

People already replying to this post seem to think this games skill is going to depend on one's fps twitch skill. Its not. The twitchplay surrounding a crosshair use is going to be far less important in a fight than:
-complementary skill builds
-use of crowd control
-use of healing
-use of buffing
-use of collision tactics
-gear statistics
We wont be playing the latest fps with numerous hitboxes requring precision with ones mouse, the hardest twitch skill is going to be leading one's shots for slow traveling spells and play Tribes if you want to practice that, not CS.

What makes fps's hard is it requires intense focus to notice blips that are people, an intuitive battle perception of where people will be, and fast mouse movement because one has milliseconds to get a headshot before his enemy does. Darkfall will not have any of these defining combat as battles will be drawn out by rpg statistics.

lol i mispelled twitch as twist twice in my post

[Unfriendly]

when really they have no idea what they are talking about

read: irony

[Jayaris]

made my account to say I 110% agree with your post. After looking over the board it seems everyone has the same idea of how this game is going to me twitch/skill bases.

When the devs say SKILL, i don't think they are talking about twitch skill. But the skills that you LEVEL UP, ei. swordplay, blocking,axes ect.

I swear this board is filled with the same SKILL bs that the AOC forum was filled with, tons of morons talking about how it's gonna be so /skill/ based when really they have no idea what they are talking about



lol i mispelled twitch as twist twice in my post

This isn't AoC there is no such thing as '110' per CENT - GTFO

[Aeros]

I completely side with the OP on this argument...
Now if only I could figure out what side he stands for...
:lmao:

[JackyD]

your way: drill instructor wins every time, not because he uses his environment to his advantage, has better aim, or better timing... no he wins because recruit hits him for 1 damage and gets hit for 50 damage (whatever)
if they fought 5000 times then instructor would win 5000 times
RECRUIT HAS NO CHANCE WHATSOEVER OF WINNING

my way: drill instructor should win every time, because he uses his environment to his advantage, has better aim, and better timing... he still has to fight though.. the game does not simply give him the victory and if recruit is good (player skill) HE MIGHT WIN


maybe that will help you get the fucking point... I doubt it though

In your little utopia maybe, or in a motion picture maybe, but not in RL unless he already has had some prior combat training which would make him not being a toon with all skills at 1.

Get real all full trained combattant will always wipe the floor with someone who has no experience/training when matching in a fair fight. Now when you'd tell me you could probably overwhelm him when there were a few of you or when luring him a trap, I'm all for it, but then again isn't it that way in DF already?

As somebody else stated already, the difference in DF will be that the Vet will be able to being overwhelmed by 4-5 new players and not as in other MMORPG's where a maxxed out char can kill entire nations of lvl 1 toons.

I completely side with the OP on this argument...
Now if only I could figure out what side he stands for...
:lmao:

I'm in my own camp as it seems, I welcome the action/twitch oriented additions to the gameplay but I don't want fundamental RPG aspects fully left out.

[REANIMATED]

Character progression through skill improvement and gear progression are fundamental parts of role playing games also referred to as RPG! Now here comes the trick: Darkfall will, according to the Devs, be an RPG too and therefore both aforementioned parts will be implemented and they will play a big role when it comes to how your character performs.

If you don't want these elements in a game then maybe the RPG segment of the MMO market isn't the right one for you? Maybe you should wait for a company to release "Counterstrike World" or something alike but pls stop fucking up RPG games where the major points of the games are roleplaying somebody/thing else and character progression.

I don't know where most of you come from but I come from pen and paper RPGs and have always seen MMORPG as the same just on a larger scale, hell that was the most excitment for me not being restricted to RP only with my closest friends but with ppl from all over the world.

The only downside I always found in these game was the lvl of restrictedness there was and I'm glad that there finally will be an RPG that allows full freedom gameplay (I sadly never had the possibility to play old UO as I had no PC or internets until late 1999 and didn't hear about MMORPGs until 2001).

Now 7 years after my first online gaming experience there finally comes a RPG that offers nearly full freedom coupled with territorial conquest and what I seem to hear the most are complaints about the basics of RPGs?

Oh and to those that like to call me carebear go ahead just think about this: If I were the Devs than the game had perma death just as in good old pen and paper RPGs, but I guess you were too carebear to play those?


Wow dude you need to chill out....This is how darkfall was meant to be from the start and if you dont like it dont play it becuase i could care less and the other 1000's people thats been waiting for this game could care less also

This is the game that we want and we dont want anymore wow clones or eq clones .We want something thats differnt has great pvp and non gear dependent .

The only thing that will help a vet of darkfall vs a new guy is pretty much the time you put in to your skill build but even that wont help you if cant use your skills effectively.So if you cant handle that darkfall is not for you

[Unfriendly]

more useless shit

lol of course you didn't get the point.. what was I thinking to expect that you actually might?

fucking retard

[Jayaris]

Oh and to those that like to call me carebear go ahead just think about this: If I were the Devs than the game had perma death just as in good old pen and paper RPGs, but I guess you were too carebear to play those?

Oh yeah, clearly you aren't a care bear because you used to cross out your character's name on a piece of paper, I wish - Truly, I wish I was as bad ass and as hardcore as you. You saying you want perma death in Darkfall is all good and well I mean after all we can't prove whether or not you would quit the game crying.
But I don't really think perma-death would make the game even remotely successful because a group of people could just decide to create a guild with the single purpose of traveling in groups of 40 new characters and attacking anyone they see.

Wouldn't that be fun, then again you are a guy who finds writing on a piece of paper entertaining while he slays an imaginary dragon.

[REANIMATED]

I cant wait to make a character and own some dude that thinks he is great becuase he invested so much time getting great gear for me to only take it and sell it to a npc vendor

[Killuan]

The Dev quote actually says that a full fledged Vet could stand his own against 4-5 toons fresh outta the box, look it up it's on warcry I think

your way: drill instructor wins every time, not because he uses his environment to his advantage, has better aim, or better timing... no he wins because recruit hits him for 1 damage and gets hit for 50 damage (whatever)
if they fought 5000 times then instructor would win 5000 times
RECRUIT HAS NO CHANCE WHATSOEVER OF WINNING

my way: drill instructor should win every time, because he uses his environment to his advantage, has better aim, and better timing... he still has to fight though.. the game does not simply give him the victory and if recruit is good (player skill) HE MIGHT WIN


Lets think this way... i.e. you are born in the world have the same education or (weapon mastery) as everybody... you are just older, have more background stuff, more experience, knows some tricks... and got the dragonepiczarmorofshiningbear... so a fucking "brat" (recently created char) comes out of nowhere wearing the ragsofpukedbeggars, and after a long fight he wins over you... becouse you suck, big time, you loose your armor... he is clearly better skilled than you... why? if he's a new char?

so, frustrated, you take your spare dragonepiczarmorofshiningbear from the bank and your spare weapon... goes to a place where noobs start the game and find 4 of them... so its 4x1 and you kill them all at the same time easily or at least see them hitting at each other in panic trying to hit you... :rolleyes:

its not a matter of veterans and nubcakes aprentices... the matter is, if you get hitted too much you loose.. no matter your armor... level... or time played ... like other games... what is really frustrating... time played > player skill

So Its not a chance to old chars to loose to new ones randomly, or good equips x bad equips... its just a real possibility! that what's really supposed to happen... you make a mistake, the other player overcomes you (i'm not saying easily, he clearly is better at the game than you, he dont even need to be a recent player you see?)... so you get yourself red necktie... no matter your 24/7 playtime addiction...

Thats what the devs intended.... REAL player skill > time played + equips... but you can put them all together and get a "one man army" :D

[GrayGhost79]

Looking for it now Dev's have said a new player can beat a veteran player if his skill is better Player skills.

Well I looked I can't find anything since they rearanged the forums lol but anyways my point is... No it's not going to happen on a regular basis, but if a player is truely better than you, your gear isn't going to save you. If you remember in the Video that was a armorless Alfar in the tree I think he did die but after taken a person or two with him. You said it's an MMORPG, yes I agree 100% you said there wouldn't be FPS elements well your wrong. You say people will be dissapointed on how item based this game is going to be. There i'm pretty sure your wrong since the Dev's have said main focus is on player Skill. I also agree a Veteran player should be able to take out 5 newbs. Then again Newbs and Vet players with new chars are completely different things now arent they. A new player has no skill at that moment in time. It takes time to develop. The person behind the new char isn't always a newb though.

"Have any steps been taken to ease the meat grinder effect on new players as they enter the Darkfall world?

Let's assume for the sake of argument that there's an area in Darkfall where "lowbie hunters" like to camp for newbs. Most of the time, these individuals or groups will end up fighting each other. In Darkfall you're never sure how advanced or new a player is since we have no levels.

Furthermore, in Darkfall, starting players are not helpless and can defend themselves well enough, and in groups they can discourage people from preying on them. There are guards in starting areas providing protection. There are guards in clan cities if the new players are in a clan. There's an invulnerability period of several minutes after death as long as the player doesn't perform an action. The world is truly huge so it's very easy to avoid people, especially with the lack of radar. "

It was a similar question where a Dev said a new player that has better player skills than the more seasoned player could win.

Anythings possible in DF and it might be best if none of us go in with any assumptions because in all honesty it looks like there trying not only to break the mold but destroy it lol. Combats gonna be a bit FPS/Hack and Slash with active blocking and maybe parrying. Other than that... Yes it's going to be a MMORPG with a less emphasis on Items than your average MMORPG. This is just based on the information passed down to us by the dev's granted none actualy said hack and slash but I can't realy see it being thought of other wise for melee that has no auto attack or lock on.

[Jreed]

so you all expect this game to be an glorified CS knifefight mmo?

[Jayaris]

so you all expect this game to be an glorified CS knifefight mmo?

I had hoped so..

[Unfriendly]

so you all expect this game to be an glorified CS knifefight mmo?

I would take that any day over another "time played > skill" game that nubs seem to love so much.

[GrayGhost79]

so you all expect this game to be an glorified CS knifefight mmo?

No I think most just expect it to be a Skilled based MMORPG like the devs have said. That meaning player skill and char skill which the devs have also said. To not be as item based as the majority of other MMORPG like the devs have said. So I guess were just expecting it to be what the Devs have said it will be lol.

[REANIMATED]

so you all expect this game to be an glorified CS knifefight mmo?


Im sorry but you can have all the best spells and weapons in the game but if you cant aim worth the damn and dont know how to dodge or jump or use your surroundings you deserve to die. Thats how i see this game and thats how the majority see it.

[Slisk]

I understand the OP's concerns but the bottom line is that Darkfall will not have a statistics based roll of the dice outcome to every event. Character progression in skills will allow for faster, more powerful attacks and blocks and a greater range of options in combat. It won't win the battles for you.

If you want to see how character progression subtly affects combat skills go play Mount and Blade. Excellent combat system where higher level characters are much more effective in combat but as a noob if you time your attacks well block well and pick your battles, you'll still have a good chance coming out on top.

[JackyD]

Im sorry but you can have all the best spells and weapons in the game but if you cant aim worth the damn and dont know how to dodge or jump or use your surroundings you deserve to die. Thats how i see this game and thats how the majority see it.

Yes but if I aim like a sniper, know how to dodge or jump and use my surroundings and I have the best spells and weapons than you should not win against me when your toon is fresh outta the box unless you overcome me with numbers or trap me in some other fashion.

[JackyD]

I understand the OP's concerns but the bottom line is that Darkfall will not have a statistics based roll of the dice outcome to every event. Character progression in skills will allow for faster, more powerful attacks and blocks and a greater range of options in combat. It won't win the battles for you.

If you want to see how character progression subtly affects combat skills go play Mount and Blade. Excellent combat system where higher level characters are much more effective in combat but as a noob if you time your attacks well block well and pick your battles, you'll still have a good chance coming out on top.

Aye that's exactly my point, but I've got the impression that alot of ppl would want this to be like a true FPS where the skills and gear are only there for fluff and have no impact at all.

[Jreed]

Im sorry but you can have all the best spells and weapons in the game but if you cant aim worth the damn and dont know how to dodge or jump or use your surroundings you deserve to die. Thats how i see this game and thats how the majority see it.
so are you implying that it actually took much skill to run/strafe/jump/avoid and knife?

[Jayaris]

so are you implying that it actually took much skill to run/strafe/jump/avoid and knife?

I do feel quite skillful while I'm mashing my space bar and holding strafe keys..

[REANIMATED]

Yes but if I aim like a sniper, know how to dodge or jump and use my surroundings and I have the best spells and weapons than you should not win against me when your toon is fresh outta the box unless you overcome me with numbers or trap me in some other fashion.

Thats what im saying your player skill comes in if you can aim like a sniper and your weapons and armor is better You deserve to win but if your a guy who has the same armor and so forth but cant aim worth a damn or do anything great you deserve to lose to a better player.....Even if that player doesnt have the best armor or weapons or have the amount of spells a person playing longer has

[GrayGhost79]

Yes but if I aim like a sniper, know how to dodge or jump and use my surroundings and I have the best spells and weapons than you should not win against me when your toon is fresh outta the box unless you overcome me with numbers or trap me in some other fashion.

I'll summerize what you just said.

But if I have good player skills and have better spells and and weapons ........

Wait for it....
Wait for it....
I think.... Wait... yes .... I think she got it finaly.

[REANIMATED]

so are you implying that it actually took much skill to run/strafe/jump/avoid and knife?

so your saying if you cant do anything good like like run/strafe/jump/avoid and knife but u have the skill biulds and weapons u deserve to win?

if thats the case how is this game any differnt from wow with just a few more pvp features?

[JackyD]

Thats what im saying your player skill comes in if you can aim like a sniper and your weapons and armor is better You deserve to win but if your a guy who has the same armor and so forth but cant aim worth a damn or do anything great you deserve to lose to a better player.....Even if that player doesnt have the best armor or weapons or have the amount of spells a person playing longer has

Good to see we finally have a consensus, my gripe goes against those that ask for every not personal related skill element to be non existent and by that removing RPG gameplay basics from an RPG game :)

[GrayGhost79]

Well ive said all I had to say really but I did want to add one last thing now that everythings cleared up. You don't get more item based than an FPS game, The guy with the Bazooka that can jump and aim fairly decent tends to win if you just that crappy 22. no matter how much skill you got...... You run out of ammo ....... The guy your chasing grabs a vest that makes him invulnerable then turns and starts chasing you...... Health packs...... well theres to many items in to many FPS games to cover even half of them in any reasonable time frame but you get my point right?

[REANIMATED]

Good to see we finally have a consensus, my gripe goes against those that ask for every not personal related skill element to be non existent and by that removing RPG gameplay basics from an RPG game :)

Well i dont care if a player has all the best items if you cant play the game .You should not beable to win ...Now im not saying a noobie should 1 shit ya or anything it should take a hell alot more skill and time to take down a player with the best items but the person who has the best items shouldnt be indestructible

noobie hits your for 1 damage and u hit the noobie for 4 damage but if you cant hit the noobie for the 4 damage and the noobie hits you evertime your gear doesnt matter then

[Jreed]

so your saying if you cant do anything good like like run/strafe/jump/avoid and knife but u have the skill biulds and weapons u deserve to win?

if thats the case how is this game any differnt from wow with just a few more pvp features?

Originally Posted by Jreed View Post
so are you implying that it actually took much skill to run/strafe/jump/avoid and knife?
----------
is what I said earlier, if you can't grasp the english language that well .I was asking if you all actually considered knife fights to take much skill, in a rhetorical question of course

[REANIMATED]

Originally Posted by Jreed View Post
so are you implying that it actually took much skill to run/strafe/jump/avoid and knife?
----------
is what I said earlier, if you can't grasp the english language that well .I was asking if you all actually considered knife fights to take much skill, in a rhetorical question of course

Yes .I think it should take skill to know when to do those functions

[Grimskeggr]

Darkfall is neither first person nor a shooter.

[ForzikTheFeared]

Character progression through skill improvement and gear progression are fundamental parts of role playing games also referred to as RPG! Now here comes the trick: Darkfall will, according to the Devs, be an RPG too and therefore both aforementioned parts will be implemented and they will play a big role when it comes to how your character performs.

If you don't want these elements in a game then maybe the RPG segment of the MMO market isn't the right one for you? Maybe you should wait for a company to release "Counterstrike World" or something alike but pls stop fucking up RPG games where the major points of the games are roleplaying somebody/thing else and character progression.

I don't know where most of you come from but I come from pen and paper RPGs and have always seen MMORPG as the same just on a larger scale, hell that was the most excitment for me not being restricted to RP only with my closest friends but with ppl from all over the world.

The only downside I always found in these game was the lvl of restrictedness there was and I'm glad that there finally will be an RPG that allows full freedom gameplay (I sadly never had the possibility to play old UO as I had no PC or internets until late 1999 and didn't hear about MMORPGs until 2001).

Now 7 years after my first online gaming experience there finally comes a RPG that offers nearly full freedom coupled with territorial conquest and what I seem to hear the most are complaints about the basics of RPGs?

Oh and to those that like to call me carebear go ahead just think about this: If I were the Devs than the game had perma death just as in good old pen and paper RPGs, but I guess you were too carebear to play those?

You "don't" have to play this game you know?


This is the kind of person that grouped with others and bitch until they get their way on the forums taking away from why people played/wanted to play the game in the first place.

[Porthios]

DF is definitely an MMORPGFPS. New genres ftw!

[JackyD]

You "don't" have to play this game you know?


This is the kind of person that grouped with others and bitch until they get their way on the forums taking away from why people played/wanted to play the game in the first place.

I thought people would want to play this game as it offers what an RPG should offer, the freedom to do whatever you want to do as long as it correlates with the setting and not for it to be some fantasy FPS in a persistent world.

I'm also not advocating to remove the twitch elements from the game, quite the contrary I welcome them, I just don't want to have character progression have so little impact that it could' ve been left out completely.

Heck I' ve been hating the auto attack feature since the 1st time I've played an MMORPG and have therefore never played a melee class because the auto attack gave me the feel of not playing that char actively.

[boar]

Shut your sniveling hole. Those who want the "grind" over the "gameplay" can go back to EQ, WoW, or whatever other place you came from.

Oh wait, but you expected that attack didn't you?

On another note though, I hear what you are saying, and I believe that we don't know what to expect from a game like this. I mean, if you could get the same satisfaction from fighting, adventuring, building empires, conspiracies, etc, etc, wouldn't that be more fun than just leveling, getting loot, and doing it all over again?

Let's hope.

[Realbigdeal22]

I thought people would want to play this game as it offers what an RPG should offer, the freedom to do whatever you want to do as long as it correlates with the setting and not for it to be some fantasy FPS in a persistent world.

I'm also not advocating to remove the twitch elements from the game, quite the contrary I welcome them, I just don't want to have character progression have so little impact that it could' ve been left out completely.

Heck I' ve been hating the auto attack feature since the 1st time I've played an MMORPG and have therefore never played a melee class because the auto attack gave me the feel of not playing that char actively.

If you dont like darkfall online for wat it will be and autoattack eather so you cant play wow,

Wait for mortal online when it will come out.

[Realbigdeal22]

Character progression through skill improvement and gear progression are fundamental parts of role playing games also referred to as RPG! Now here comes the trick: Darkfall will, according to the Devs, be an RPG too and therefore both aforementioned parts will be implemented and they will play a big role when it comes to how your character performs.

If you don't want these elements in a game then maybe the RPG segment of the MMO market isn't the right one for you? Maybe you should wait for a company to release "Counterstrike World" or something alike but pls stop fucking up RPG games where the major points of the games are roleplaying somebody/thing else and character progression.

I don't know where most of you come from but I come from pen and paper RPGs and have always seen MMORPG as the same just on a larger scale, hell that was the most excitment for me not being restricted to RP only with my closest friends but with ppl from all over the world.

The only downside I always found in these game was the lvl of restrictedness there was and I'm glad that there finally will be an RPG that allows full freedom gameplay (I sadly never had the possibility to play old UO as I had no PC or internets until late 1999 and didn't hear about MMORPGs until 2001).

Now 7 years after my first online gaming experience there finally comes a RPG that offers nearly full freedom coupled with territorial conquest and what I seem to hear the most are complaints about the basics of RPGs?

Oh and to those that like to call me carebear go ahead just think about this: If I were the Devs than the game had perma death just as in good old pen and paper RPGs, but I guess you were too carebear to play those?

Perma death lol.What about monlty fee's you fool. Stop trolling.Yes this is a troll and you cant counter back my post.

[Realbigdeal22]

I have no problem with the more "twitch" oriented gameplay, I even welcome it. And I'm not really complaining, just wanted to make a point to all those that cry for skills & gear not to have any effect on your character's performance that they prolly will be badly surprised when they get to play the game and realise that JackVet who's all decked out and has his skills maxed will have an ez game JoeNub who just logged his char in for the 1st time.

Dont you get it,i left wow because we have to grind to make our spot.In darkdall online,you could make your spot in day 1.If you was a dev,you would be poor because you would make an other wow clone.Think about it.Think about us.(Excluding wow carebears)

[Realbigdeal22]

Yes but if I aim like a sniper, know how to dodge or jump and use my surroundings and I have the best spells and weapons than you should not win against me when your toon is fresh outta the box unless you overcome me with numbers or trap me in some other fashion.

If you dont have mindgame whit all those good skills and gear,you die.Thats the best rule you can get.

[Realbigdeal22]

Good to see we finally have a consensus, my gripe goes against those that ask for every not personal related skill element to be non existent and by that removing RPG gameplay basics from an RPG game :)

full rpg is for Ubisoft(elder scroll oblivion.)

We will stay in darfall online.(online pvp/rpg

[Renvex]

Character progression through skill improvement and gear progression are fundamental parts of role playing games also referred to as RPG! Now here comes the trick: Darkfall will, according to the Devs, be an RPG too and therefore both aforementioned parts will be implemented and they will play a big role when it comes to how your character performs.


Wrong.

RPG means you're a make believe character in a make believe world. Doesn't mean Darkfall has to fit into a nice mainstream model just like all other MMORPGs.

And i'm not advocating anything other than what i posted above, nothing about whether or not gear will or wont be a fundamental part or big role.

[andy9306]

Realbigdeal22 could you please stop multi-posting? It makes it excedingly tiresome to track the progress of the conversation.

Anyway, this game is what it is. I can respect the OP's attitude towards the mixing of genres, it has been done very poorly before. However, until we see Darkfall fail, we should assume that it will be an enjoyable game. Elsewise there is no point in us being here.

[Requiamer]

To the OP, im not sure what you wanted to say, but yes i think you put the finger on the right spot about MMorpg and FPS, RP and PvP.

MMorpgs is 90% about character progression (that simulate your character life so you can RP), that clearly mean 90% character imbalance. Except if the progression would only be about aesthetics (let say as you progress you get nicer looking items/skills and spells, but the stats never change), but then it wouldn't be progression per say. The 10% left is about characters balance, or you wont be able to pvp, grouping would be a nightmare and so on.

FPS, because it is "all" about pvp, is about 90% character balance, 10% character progression (you still can find better weapon/ammo in game, but that most likely stop here your progression) to keep the fun factor to his maximum.

Now those % are totally made up, its just to explain. Some mmo will make the imbalance between pvp and rp huge, especially highly level and item based mmo, other will try to wash this a bit (DF philosophy seam to balance it 50/50 i think).
But clearly those 2 aspects are totally incompatible, you can't have a character progression, thus a more powerful character overtime, and have balance in pvp between a newb and a veteran (even if you take away the player skills, mean the newb is actually a veteran that know very well about the game and know how to play, but have a new character).
Sure they are a lot of systems to try to reduce this problem, in many mmo the pvp damage and the pve damage calculations are totally different, they are special health bar and point in pvp and so on; but whatever systems you put, you can't get this cleared, because it is about the base, the roots, the principals of those type of games.

If devs came to a good balance the game will work, if not it will fail, plain and simple. And that last statement is about PVP MMOs, not the crappy carebear lands who don't need any sort of balance because they simply banished pvp from their games. And that is the reason why most devs did banished pvp and still do it, its to risky to have both. In mmo industry most need money with minimal risk, and they don't care if they made one more crap if they can be payed well.

[JackyD]

Dont you get it,i left wow because we have to grind to make our spot.In darkdall online,you could make your spot in day 1.If you was a dev,you would be poor because you would make an other wow clone.Think about it.Think about us.(Excluding wow carebears)

Haha good joke, show me that clan city on day 1, it simply won't exist. Your clan will have to grind resources and your crafters will have to grind their crafting skills. Oh and as it seems some if not all clan city emplacement will be controlled by some NPC faction that'll have to be driven out first.

Perma death lol.What about monlty fee's you fool. Stop trolling.Yes this is a troll and you cant counter back my post.

Well there should at leastbe an option to challenge some1 to a perma death duel. Or is that too hardcore for ya?

The rest of your comments is just about the same gibberish as the rest of the FPS crowd in here is uttering so I'll pass on commenting that.

To the OP, im not sure what you wanted to say, but yes i think you put the finger on the right spot about MMorpg and FPS, RP and PvP.

MMorpgs is 90% about character progression (that simulate your character life so you can RP), that clearly mean 90% character imbalance. Except if the progression would only be about aesthetics (let say as you progress you get nicer looking items/skills and spells, but the stats never change), but then it wouldn't be progression per say. The 10% left is about characters balance, or you wont be able to pvp, grouping would be a nightmare and so on.

FPS, because it is "all" about pvp, is about 90% character balance, 10% character progression (you still can find better weapon/ammo in game, but that most likely stop here your progression) to keep the fun factor to his maximum.

Now those % are totally made up, its just to explain. Some mmo will make the imbalance between pvp and rp huge, especially highly level and item based mmo, other will try to wash this a bit (DF philosophy seam to balance it 50/50 i think).
But clearly those 2 aspects are totally incompatible, you can't have a character progression, thus a more powerful character overtime, and have balance in pvp between a newb and a veteran (even if you take away the player skills, mean the newb is actually a veteran that know very well about the game and know how to play, but have a new character).
Sure they are a lot of systems to try to reduce this problem, in many mmo the pvp damage and the pve damage calculations are totally different, they are special health bar and point in pvp and so on; but whatever systems you put, you can't get this cleared, because it is about the base, the roots, the principals of those type of games.

If devs came to a good balance the game will work, if not it will fail, plain and simple. And that last statement is about PVP MMOs, not the crappy carebear lands who don't need any sort of balance because they simply banished pvp from their games. And that is the reason why most devs did banished pvp and still do it, its to risky to have both. In mmo industry most need money with minimal risk, and they don't care if they made one more crap if they can be payed well.

Aye there needs to be a balance and I think the Devs a right on the with the design of how Bosses don't respawn in the same spot, don't respawn for a large amount of time. That way these rare uber loot items won't be widespread but only a handful (like 4-5) will be in the hands of the players at any given time.

Then there' s full loot which will make ppl think twice before using them and item decay which again will assure that servers won't be fludded with uber gear.

On a side note: what do some of you guys believe will await the lucky clan or clan alliance that manages to gather all 16 word stones?

[Thorpeyrox]

Dont you get it,i left wow because we have to grind to make our spot.In darkdall online,you could make your spot in day 1.If you was a dev,you would be poor because you would make an other wow clone.Think about it.Think about us.(Excluding wow carebears)

No, simply no.

[DaveDFF]

About 1/8 of Forumfall basically thinks of it as pure PvP and nothing else. -.-

And thats what is going to make this so great, great post by the OP.

[Deneb]

As some are asking why I'm posting this:

When reading these forums and skimming through the polls and the replies to them most of the people posting here give me the impression that they expect Darkfall to become something more akin to an FPS and some even seem to want all RPG removed from the game. So I wanted to point out my thoughts about this and get some general feedback from forumfall on that topic.

Actually, I have to agree with you on this. There seems to be some people here who want Darkfall to be like CS but with melee weapons. However, I wouldn't worry since I'm sure these folks are in the minority.

[Coverzin]

Character progression through skill improvement and gear progression are fundamental parts of role playing games also referred to as RPG! Now here comes the trick: Darkfall will, according to the Devs, be an RPG too and therefore both aforementioned parts will be implemented and they will play a big role when it comes to how your character performs.

If you don't want these elements in a game then maybe the RPG segment of the MMO market isn't the right one for you? Maybe you should wait for a company to release "Counterstrike World" or something alike but pls stop fucking up RPG games where the major points of the games are roleplaying somebody/thing else and character progression.

I don't know where most of you come from but I come from pen and paper RPGs and have always seen MMORPG as the same just on a larger scale, hell that was the most excitment for me not being restricted to RP only with my closest friends but with ppl from all over the world.

The only downside I always found in these game was the lvl of restrictedness there was and I'm glad that there finally will be an RPG that allows full freedom gameplay (I sadly never had the possibility to play old UO as I had no PC or internets until late 1999 and didn't hear about MMORPGs until 2001).

Now 7 years after my first online gaming experience there finally comes a RPG that offers nearly full freedom coupled with territorial conquest and what I seem to hear the most are complaints about the basics of RPGs?

Oh and to those that like to call me carebear go ahead just think about this: If I were the Devs than the game had perma death just as in good old pen and paper RPGs, but I guess you were too carebear to play those?

+1

[Realbigdeal22]

+1

-1 for the fucking wall text.

[Blixa]

nice post OP, but your perma-death comment destroyed your point. Perma-death really doesn't support the RPG... all Character Developement in a game where your character dies in several seconds and is gone forever? Have fun creating a new character everyday (Tasos said you'll die alot in DF). Also - who would siege a city? You can gain a city, yes, but lose your character.

Although perma-death seems hardcore at first, it actually makes most players turning into carebears. Same as if you would implent full loot in WoW - is just wouldn't work.

[Realbigdeal22]

No, simply no.

Explain your self why not?(your faq)

[Thorpeyrox]

Explain your self why not?(your faq)

Explain yourself, why do you think Darkfall will be different?
Why do you think that in Darkfall you can make yourself a spot from day one?

[Realbigdeal22]

nice post OP, but your perma-death comment destroyed your point. Perma-death really doesn't support the RPG... all Character Developement in a game where your character dies in several seconds and is gone forever? Have fun creating a new character everyday (Tasos said you'll die alot in DF). Also - who would siege a city? You can gain a city, yes, but lose your character.

Although perma-death seems hardcore at first, it actually makes most players turning into carebears. Same as if you would implent full loot in WoW - is just wouldn't work.

Hmmmm,they added a perma death server in diablo 2 remember?

They could add server whit perma death.But i mean some like 10 server pvp,2 server perma death.Because wo would whant to join this server?

[Realbigdeal22]

Explain yourself, why do you think Darkfall will be different?
Why do you think that in Darkfall you can make yourself a spot from day one?

Because i heard it.Do you remember that you can kill veterans from day 1?In wow, you cant do shit at level one.Kill 10 rats.

In darkfall, whit atleast 3 or 4 friends in the 1st day,you can kill some veterans.You can even help a clan siege a castle.

In battlefield 2,at the 1st day,you can kill any one.In darkfall online too.

You find this info on the news forum

[Kekshorts]

Hmmmm,they added a perma death server in diablo 2 remember?

They could add server whit perma death.But i mean some like 10 server pvp,2 server perma death.Because wo would whant to join this server?
yeah but in diablo 2 you didn't die in a couple of hits and there was more or less consensual pvp and no epic battles.

[JackyD]

nice post OP, but your perma-death comment destroyed your point. Perma-death really doesn't support the RPG... all Character Developement in a game where your character dies in several seconds and is gone forever? Have fun creating a new character everyday (Tasos said you'll die alot in DF). Also - who would siege a city? You can gain a city, yes, but lose your character.

Although perma-death seems hardcore at first, it actually makes most players turning into carebears. Same as if you would implent full loot in WoW - is just wouldn't work.

As explained to another poster perma death sould be a duel option for when some1 really pisses you of. I know myself that having perma death on every death wouldn't work in an MMO,

Edit: Oh and this topic ain't about perma death or not, so let's stop 'bout nit picking on that and lets get back on topic

[Blixa]

As explained to another poster perma death sould be a duel option for when some1 really pisses you of. I know myself that having perma death on every death wouldn't work in an MMO,

Hey, this idea doesn't sound too bad ;-)
Didn't see that posting of yours before

[Realbigdeal22]

yeah but in diablo 2 you didn't die in a couple of hits and there was more or less consensual pvp and no epic battles.

You right,If we get perma death,It would be like contra online.So dont forget to use the cheat for 30 life.

[Jreed]

Actually, I have to agree with you on this. There seems to be some people here who want Darkfall to be like CS but with melee weapons. However, I wouldn't worry since I'm sure these folks are in the minority.

+1

[JackyD]

Because i heard it.Do you remember that you can kill veterans from day 1?In wow, you cant do shit at level one.Kill 10 rats.

In darkfall, whit atleast 3 or 4 friends in the 1st day,you can kill some veterans.You can even help a clan siege a castle.

In battlefield 2,at the 1st day,you can kill any one.In darkfall online too.

You find this info on the news forum

Yes, see you're saying it yourself with 3 or 4 friends but very unlikely on a 1 vs 1 scenario, therefore char progression and gear will have an impact!

[Thorpeyrox]

Because i heard it.Do you remember that you can kill veterans from day 1?In wow, you cant do shit at level one.Kill 10 rats.

In darkfall, whit atleast 3 or 4 friends in the 1st day,you can kill some veterans.You can even help a clan siege a castle.

In battlefield 2,at the 1st day,you can kill any one.In darkfall online too.

You find this info on the news forum

It's supposed to be a selling point my friend, hyperbole at its best.
Do you really think that the first day you play the game you'll really be making a difference to world-shaking sieges?
I'm sorry it's all hype.
Edit: As for the friends part - yes with friends you can kill someone if they come alone v.s. 4 people... they are doomed to fail. However a veteran may not be geared to the max or have the apporpiate skills to deal with multiple people.

[Requiamer]

It's supposed to be a selling point my friend, hyperbole at its best.
Do you really think that the first day you play the game you'll really be making a difference to world-shaking sieges?
I'm sorry it's all hype.
Edit: As for the friends part - yes with friends you can kill someone if they come alone v.s. 4 people... they are doomed to fail. However a veteran may not be geared to the max or have the apporpiate skills to deal with multiple people.

Maybe not the first day, but if after few days you can get your first skill, say your main weapon skill, to max so you could do something, i think that is fair enough.

[Thorpeyrox]

Maybe not the first day, but if after few days you can get your first skill, say your main weapon skill, to max so you could do something, i think that is fair enough.

This I agree with but the thought of people thinking they can walk into the Darkfall World a few years down the line and change the world within their first days trouble me. However in this case no one will be changing the world of Darkfall until a month+ minimum (people joining on release that is). Grind will be needed before anything truely dramatic can happen.

[Milo Hobgoblin]

does anyone have a dork decoder ring and can figure out what the fuck the point of the OPs post is?

[Agge]

Cry me a fucking river. I love how you tried to save face with the perma death bullshit.

If you don't like PLAYER skill combat, then there is other games for you. Don't even start with the whole roleplay bullshit, this will be the first game where everyone automaticly will play a role!

Pff, get out of here.

[JackyD]

Cry me a fucking river. I love how you tried to save face with the perma death bullshit.

If you don't like PLAYER skill combat, then there is other games for you. Don't even start with the whole roleplay bullshit, this will be the first game where everyone automaticly will play a role!

Pff, get out of here.

:lmao:

[Requiamer]

nice post OP, but your perma-death comment destroyed your point. Perma-death really doesn't support the RPG... all Character Developement in a game where your character dies in several seconds and is gone forever? Have fun creating a new character everyday (Tasos said you'll die alot in DF). Also - who would siege a city? You can gain a city, yes, but lose your character.

Although perma-death seems hardcore at first, it actually makes most players turning into carebears. Same as if you would implent full loot in WoW - is just wouldn't work.

Who say perma death is about second? and yes Df might not be a good design to implement perma death, but it doesn't mean some design couldn't get perma death very well done. In a hard core Rp design you could get a perma death feature work pretty well. Also your statement are totally false, RP history is all about perma death, and about making new roles every few months. In fact i think perma death is the next step (after pvp) to be dealt with in the mmo industry. And i'm pretty sure the combat will be as intense as it was to put pvp back in the mmorpg genre.

[Helgeran]

Massive Multiplayer Online First Person Sworder imo since 2005. Alright, really that term is faulty because you sword people in 3rd person.

[Erwinor]

I think the OP read too many "Darkfall is for hardcore badasses like myself" comments and got this idea. Pay no mind, I am looking for exploring and crafting as much as PVP.

[Needles]

http://www.huxleygame.com/

[Curcio]

I don't plan to become a hardcore ganker. I will mostly just be enjoying the freedom the game promises as the main selling point. Oh and the FPS combat. :)

[Level9-Fiss]

Who say perma death is about second? and yes Df might not be a good design to implement perma death, but it doesn't mean some design couldn't get perma death very well done. In a hard core Rp design you could get a perma death feature work pretty well. Also your statement are totally false, RP history is all about perma death, and about making new roles every few months. In fact i think perma death is the next step (after pvp) to be dealt with in the mmo industry. And i'm pretty sure the combat will be as intense as it was to put pvp back in the mmorpg genre.
would be too annoying to make such changes now IMO, better to focus on making the game not suck.