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Rezwarius
06-05-2011, 17:10
Vendors, that sell Ready Bags with complete sets of equipment, weapons, regs, and armor, for the one basic style of play.

I want to click ONE button to buy a bag (and make it cheap) with everything I need in it to pvp..

FUCK grinding for 4 hours to get gear to pvp for 9 minutes.
FUCK sorting a bag of low durability gear for 15 minutes to pvp for 9 minutes.
FUCK it, because some people only have two hours to play. and that means two days of farming for 9 minutes of pvp...

ISN'T THIS A PVP GAME?? GIVE ME EASY PVP.

Horseman
06-05-2011, 17:23
Go play counterstrike.

Cheap easy readybags = meaningless loss

smackyou
06-05-2011, 17:30
I dont think my ready bag is the same as yours, or as his...or as any one else.

Not everybody takes same amount of regs or same enchants or same type of armor. So no i dont like it.

Yes its a bitch to create ready bags but it will have no meaning just buying them ready.

Maybe you should practice to get better to stay alive more than 9mins or maybe an mmorpg is not meant for you. But your more looking for an fps game that you get quick action for short amount of time. mmos takes time to play.

Irenor
06-05-2011, 19:14
NPC Vendor selling Ready Bags? Hell No. Players selling Ready Bags? Hell yeah. DarkFall needs to improve the Crafting side of the game to encourage dedicated crafters, and do away with the "I can craft everything" bullshit. Also needs more tools for players to sell their items such as Trade Hubs (I don't like Auction Houses).

Melkorus
06-05-2011, 19:33
All DF needs is a way to make EQUIPMENT SETs. Like, for example, whatever you are wearing on your currently, you click a button, and it creates a set, one icon, but maintains the weight of all items combined, and when you mouse over it, it gives you the list of all items in the set including their dura, and total weight and total encumbrance (after enchanting). Put that fucker on player vendor, good game.

TheHamburglar
06-05-2011, 19:45
quick hint. Spend 15 mins making 10 ready bags at the same time. Then u can go and die 10 times in a row without having to make a new bag each time

MaxiHori
06-05-2011, 19:48
Go play counterstrike.
it's not really a good joke since most of the people already left this game


Cheap easy readybags = meaningless loss
cheap bag = cheap loss
a bone with some reags and a r5 can be something like that...
do you fear someone wearing a bone???


quick hint. Spend 15 mins making 10 ready bags at the same time. Then u can go and die 10 times in a row without having to make a new bag each time
15 mins to create 10 ready bags? o_O

B. Greymoor
06-05-2011, 20:43
Whilst the OP uses strong words he does hit one point...

This game really needs a feature which allows you to have pre-set templates when making bags. Let me explain.
You open a UI window for bags, select all the different armour pieces, reg amounts, mount amounts, pot amounts etc. This is saved for future use.
Now when you double click an empty bag you can select that template and it will attempt to place all the listed items into the bag automatically from your inventory/bank.

Combined this with being able to create full armour sets that are one click to equip and we're sorted!

TheHamburglar
06-05-2011, 21:03
But seriously. How long does it take to drag and drop 13 pieces of armor, 6 weapons and 7 stacks of regs/arrows? Don't forget the extra click when putting a mount in the bag >.<

ExcursionRob
06-05-2011, 21:09
NO to NPCs selling bags, yes to player vendors selling bags, player vendors need to be able to have a full bag of stuff placed on it for sale and have the purchaser be able to open it and see everything inside it before purchase.

DAA KAPUTTMACHA
06-05-2011, 21:50
NO to NPCs selling bags, yes to player vendors selling bags, player vendors need to be able to have a full bag of stuff placed on it for sale and have the purchaser be able to open it and see everything inside it before purchase.

This.
Would be a sandboxish solution and still help the OP with his problem. And would be nice for the vendor owner, too, since it would atract more people to his vendor and he could put stuff in the ready bags people normally wouldnt buy from him. ;)

Realbigdeal22
06-05-2011, 22:14
WTB 10 hybrid ready bags. I like that idea.

KnowSin
06-06-2011, 01:46
fuck grinding for 4 hours to get gear to pvp for 9 minutes.
Fuck sorting a bag of low durability gear for 15 minutes to pvp for 9 minutes.
Fuck it, because some people only have two hours to play. And that means two days of farming for 9 minutes of pvp...

Isn't this a pvp game?? Give me easy pvp.

+1

Arrakis_Dragon
06-06-2011, 03:01
Vendors, that sell Ready Bags with complete sets of equipment, weapons, regs, and armor, for the one basic style of play.

I want to click ONE button to buy a bag (and make it cheap) with everything I need in it to pvp..

FUCK grinding for 4 hours to get gear to pvp for 9 minutes.
FUCK sorting a bag of low durability gear for 15 minutes to pvp for 9 minutes.
FUCK it, because some people only have two hours to play. and that means two days of farming for 9 minutes of pvp...

ISN'T THIS A PVP GAME?? GIVE ME EASY PVP.

Awesome idea but it seems to take AV weeks to implement something as simple as changing the sea tower timers, remember when sea towers were at every server reset XD. Bags on vendors is something I've been wanting for a LONG time and with all that empty space in the vendor window to have something added to see whats inside of bags if they went that way. They also need to "cut away" the wall of the house where the vendor is so that way you can stock your vendor safely inside of your house and not be worrying like a nervous nancy when your trying to load it with good items.

Darkfallin
06-07-2011, 01:58
If 4 hours of playtime nets you one gearbag then you're doing it wrong.

Kenjifujima
06-07-2011, 07:12
Hey there,this is Kenjifujima,glad to join this forum and glad to meet you here,I look forward to getting some inspiration and getting to know all of you.

Austin420
06-07-2011, 07:22
lol bud

traitor1
06-07-2011, 07:44
I would sell ready bags exorbitant expensive

TheHamburglar
06-07-2011, 08:01
If 4 hours of playtime nets you one gearbag then you're doing it wrong.

this.

the past week i did 10hours of pveing/gathering to make some gear bags. i made:

7 sets of:
>q4 keened cobra
>q4 keened (crafted) jb
>q3-4 feather fp helm (bc)
>1piece mob dropped fp
>rest crafted bone
>1 bluetail
>100 ea reg
>100 arrows

the only thing i didnt make were bows as i had enough from the pvp i got recently. The grinding for these bags took like 9 hours and all in all it took 1 hour to craft and sort the bags.

Btw i still made a profit after all this crafting as i was farming most mats and not buying them.

Machinistlol
06-07-2011, 08:02
this.

the past week i did 10hours of pveing/gathering to make some gear bags. i made:

7 sets of:
>q4 keened cobra
>q4 keened (crafted) jb
>q3-4 feather fp helm (bc)
>1piece mob dropped fp
>rest crafted bone
>1 bluetail
>100 ea reg
>100 arrows

the only thing i didnt make were bows as i had enough from the pvp i got recently. The grinding for these bags took like 9 hours and all in all it took 1 hour to craft and sort the bags.

Btw i still made a profit after all this crafting as i was farming most mats and not buying them.

ye come face me ill farm you like a sunday morning :ninja:

tehfora
06-07-2011, 08:08
I always thought making a changeable loadout at a vendor would be cool. Being able to set the number of regs and it would change price accordingly.

VooDoo Hex
06-07-2011, 09:47
this.

the past week i did 10hours of pveing/gathering to make some gear bags. i made:

7 sets of:
>q4 keened cobra
>q4 keened (crafted) jb
>q3-4 feather fp helm (bc)
>1piece mob dropped fp
>rest crafted bone
>1 bluetail
>100 ea reg
>100 arrows

the only thing i didnt make were bows as i had enough from the pvp i got recently. The grinding for these bags took like 9 hours and all in all it took 1 hour to craft and sort the bags.

Btw i still made a profit after all this crafting as i was farming most mats and not buying them.

lol and you could lose all those sets in two seiges. totaling 3 to 4 hours.

9 hours of PVE for 3 to 4 hours of PVP. Yeah that seems about right. NOT.

Decent gear in this game is too much of a grind to get. Especially if you are destroyer.

It's also awesome that there are only two selentine golems on the entire map. I love that.

TheHamburglar
06-07-2011, 13:52
lol and you could lose all those sets in two seiges. totaling 3 to 4 hours.

9 hours of PVE for 3 to 4 hours of PVP. Yeah that seems about right. NOT.

Decent gear in this game is too much of a grind to get. Especially if you are destroyer.

It's also awesome that there are only two selentine golems on the entire map. I love that.

voodoo yes in 4 hours of nonstop pvp i may die 10 times and so it would be more than worth the 9 hours of farming i did.

but whats more likely to happen is that ill get 4-5 bags of loot and die a few times also making me break even or make a slight loss (gear wise) but i still had 4 hours of fun.

if you dont pve like a retard it can be quite fun - go with a group, sit in mumble together joking around and killing shit. You dont have to nerd it up and be like "grrr 20k an hour... must kill more mobs.... cant play with other people.... they slow me down.... (insert general pve is bad QQ)

Rahkim
06-07-2011, 14:15
quick hint. Spend 15 mins making 10 ready bags at the same time. Then u can go and die 10 times in a row without having to make a new bag each time

exactly

paxprobellum
06-07-2011, 15:07
the past week i did 10hours of pveing/gathering to make some gear bags. i made:

7 sets of:
>q4 keened cobra
>q4 keened (crafted) jb
>q3-4 feather fp helm (bc)


So you got:
35 q4 Eye
35 q4 Tooth
35 q4 Venomsac
70 q4 Cinder
35 q4 Dtaint
35 q4 Bile
35 q4 Horn
35 q4 Quartz
14 q5 Taint of Khamset
14 Beastman Tooth
21 Dwarf Heart
7 Selentine Ingot
7 Neithal Ingot
14 Veilron Ingot

plus all the iron you would need in 10 hours? I call BS. That's conservatively 10k/hr in skins alone, not including gold (or travel time).

(I'm sure your response will be, 'I already had most of this in my bank.' But you see, my young friend, that doesn't count. You still farmed it at some point.)

grizzlednutz
06-07-2011, 16:18
I dont think my ready bag is the same as yours, or as his...or as any one else.

Not everybody takes same amount of regs or same enchants or same type of armor. So no i dont like it.

Yes its a bitch to create ready bags but it will have no meaning just buying them ready.

Maybe you should practice to get better to stay alive more than 9mins or maybe an mmorpg is not meant for you. But your more looking for an fps game that you get quick action for short amount of time. mmos takes time to play.

this mentality is why df is dead. I do see the issues with character uniqueness towards each ready bag though but the rest is just ass. DF has the worst timesink issues of any mmo in history, and you are acting as if it's no prob l2p.

dosengan
06-07-2011, 16:32
or , he bought finished products maybe? :>

Rezwarius
06-07-2011, 16:35
this mentality is why df is dead. I do see the issues with character uniqueness towards each ready bag though but the rest is just ass. DF has the worst timesink issues of any mmo in history, and you are acting as if it's no prob l2p.

i have to agree, some people don't want DF to retain more players.

grizzlednutz
06-07-2011, 16:49
this.

the past week i did 10hours of pveing/gathering to make some gear bags. i made:

7 sets of:
>q4 keened cobra
>q4 keened (crafted) jb
>q3-4 feather fp helm (bc)
>1piece mob dropped fp
>rest crafted bone
>1 bluetail
>100 ea reg
>100 arrows

the only thing i didnt make were bows as i had enough from the pvp i got recently. The grinding for these bags took like 9 hours and all in all it took 1 hour to craft and sort the bags.

Btw i still made a profit after all this crafting as i was farming most mats and not buying them.

so ONLY 10 hours pve to get that.. that's not bad at all considering most casuals might only have that much time total to play per week.

grizzlednutz
06-07-2011, 16:58
one more thing. this attitude that "maybe mmo's aren't for you.." bullshit needs to stop. not only condescending and prepubescent to say this, it's absolutely false. it's something contstructed by 12 year old ego driven kids who have all day to play nonstop.. and they think that's the standard.

World of Warcraft has proven this statement utterly false. they created an amazing game world with in depth story that gets you involved. there is so much to do in the game and guess what.. you don't need to sink 25 hours a week into it to feel like you are accomplishing something. this is why wow.. which btw is an MMO is the most successful game on the planet.

So if you are one of these " play an fps game if you want instant gratification! " guys then please, do us all a favor and fuck off. don't tell me what game i should be playing because i've probably been playing mmo's longer than you. most gamers play many types of games so don't jump to conclusions like you are shedding valuable insights on people when you tell them to go play something they probably already play on the side to begin with.

I don't want instant gratification in df.. i just want gratification of my time spent in game in general. i don't like feeling like i just wasted 2 hours of my time in any game.

Sherd
06-07-2011, 17:34
one more thing. this attitude that "maybe mmo's aren't for you.." bullshit needs to stop. not only condescending and prepubescent to say this, it's absolutely false. it's something contstructed by 12 year old ego driven kids who have all day to play nonstop.. and they think that's the standard.

World of Warcraft has proven this statement utterly false. they created an amazing game world with in depth story that gets you involved. there is so much to do in the game and guess what.. you don't need to sink 25 hours a week into it to feel like you are accomplishing something. this is why wow.. which btw is an MMO is the most successful game on the planet.

So if you are one of these " play an fps game if you want instant gratification! " guys then please, do us all a favor and fuck off. don't tell me what game i should be playing because i've probably been playing mmo's longer than you. most gamers play many types of games so don't jump to conclusions like you are shedding valuable insights on people when you tell them to go play something they probably already play on the side to begin with.

I don't want instant gratification in df.. i just want gratification of my time spent in game in general. i don't like feeling like i just wasted 2 hours of my time in any game.

And therefore removing that little sand we have in our sandbox seems a valid solution to you (or the OP)? Yes, gear grind is totally whack, but the solution is not to hand everyone a cheap ready-to-eat, instant-soup type gear collection. The OPs idea is so totally AV like ... *facepalm*

Friends Forever
06-07-2011, 17:52
Sounds like WoW is a better candidate for you. I've met tons of people who try to play this game and the grind, the pvp, or the pve aren't for them. Maybe you just might want to move on?

grizzlednutz
06-07-2011, 18:27
Sounds like WoW is a better candidate for you. I've met tons of people who try to play this game and the grind, the pvp, or the pve aren't for them. Maybe you just might want to move on?

ding ding we have a winner. i already have moved on bro, like everyone else. I don't know when you guys will get it through your heads that the game is not fine in it's current state.

grizzlednutz
06-07-2011, 18:32
And therefore removing that little sand we have in our sandbox seems a valid solution to you (or the OP)? Yes, gear grind is totally whack, but the solution is not to hand everyone a cheap ready-to-eat, instant-soup type gear collection. The OPs idea is so totally AV like ... *facepalm*

i don't know where i suggest "removing sand" in my post.. if anything i say to add more. I never said i endorsed the gear bag idea in the op's form, in fact i said i could see issues with it. The fact though that you think wasting time making a gear bag is a great sandbox feature is mind blowing to me. there is absolutely no need for the looting/gearing to be as tedious and time consuming as it is, thats all i'm saying.. it's just not fun to spend time sifting through shitty stacked items.

to sum up.. i think gearing/creating gear bags is too much of a timesink.. you agree that it's wack but for some reason think the system is fine as is.

Friends Forever
06-07-2011, 18:35
Almost everyone I've ever played with can't leave DF for another mmo because of themepark qualities of most in the genre, tab targeting, and meaningless pvp. Also, everyone I've ever talked to said they'd drop DF in a second if anything else even remotely interesting came along...sadly nothing has. This is probably one of the few games i've ever played where the people playing it are actively looking for something better.

grizzlednutz
06-07-2011, 19:05
Almost everyone I've ever played with can't leave DF for another mmo because of themepark qualities of most in the genre, tab targeting, and meaningless pvp. Also, everyone I've ever talked to said they'd drop DF in a second if anything else even remotely interesting came along...sadly nothing has. This is probably one of the few games i've ever played where the people playing it are actively looking for something better.

The reason i started playing df was because I am one of those players who really wanted meaningful "classless" pvp. The first mmo i'd really gotten into was Asheron's Call and once i'd left that game I had an incredible urge for a game that was like it.. but more up to date and polished.

I played lots of other mmo's and wow for years and then i found out about df right before it's euro launch. This was surely the game I was waiting for. I bought the game in July 09' and I loved it. I was able to put up with all the glaring flaws of the game because of the promise of exquisite meaningful classless pvp. Unfortunately, as I've come to realize, there is more to a good game than just pvp that matters.

I firmly believe a great meaningful pvp game will come out in the next few years or so that will blow all of the niche gamers who fell in love with asheron's call, shadowbane, and df away. I wish that game was df believe it or not.. but unless a miracle happens.. i doubt it.

Sherd
06-07-2011, 19:19
i don't know where i suggest "removing sand" in my post.. if anything i say to add more. I never said i endorsed the gear bag idea in the op's form, in fact i said i could see issues with it. The fact though that you think wasting time making a gear bag is a great sandbox feature is mind blowing to me. there is absolutely no need for the looting/gearing to be as tedious and time consuming as it is, thats all i'm saying.. it's just not fun to spend time sifting through shitty stacked items.

to sum up.. i think gearing/creating gear bags is too much of a timesink.. you agree that it's wack but for some reason think the system is fine as is.

If we talk about the time consumpting acuiring of gear, i'd agree that it is too timeconsumpting.

but simply assembling some bags? if one just drops all his stuff on a giant heap in the bank box, sure, that would suck then ... but ... seriously?

how can

I want to click ONE button to buy a bag (and make it cheap) with everything I need in it to pvp..
this be a valid solution to that? If one just buys the stuff he needs at a npc vendor, why would he then at all try to aquire stuff by other means. There would be no incentive in PvE anymore - besides some gold drops perhaps. AV could remove all items off the loot tables then. Thats what i meant with removing sand - making established mechanisms obsolete.

Yes, the system as such is fine. It surely needs massive adjustments, yes, but it does not need to be replaced by something boring new.

grizzlednutz
06-07-2011, 19:51
If we talk about the time consumpting acuiring of gear, i'd agree that it is too timeconsumpting.

but simply assembling some bags? if one just drops all his stuff on a giant heap in the bank box, sure, that would suck then ... but ... seriously?

how can

this be a valid solution to that? If one just buys the stuff he needs at a npc vendor, why would he then at all try to aquire stuff by other means. There would be no incentive in PvE anymore - besides some gold drops perhaps. AV could remove all items off the loot tables then. Thats what i meant with removing sand - making established mechanisms obsolete.

Yes, the system as such is fine. It surely needs massive adjustments, yes, but it does not need to be replaced by something boring new.

organizing your bags = time.. so either way your arguement involves tedious timesinks. either you spend lots of time meticulously organizing your bags, or you spend a lot of time making the gear bags.. and either way you have to kinda do both. my bag was organized to a degree.. it was as organized as it needed to be for me to find shit.. but it wasn't mega organized .. that would have taken too much time. I'm not the only one who hates the loot system and I'm willing to bet the only people who like it are probably huge fans of uo.

As for your other point about not pve'ing just because you can buy a pre-made gear bag. I don't understand the logic. It would not wipe out all pve as we know it. People would still need to farm for materials/drops/gold.

paxprobellum
06-07-2011, 20:03
so ONLY 10 hours pve to get that.. that's not bad at all considering most casuals might only have that much time total to play per week.

I think this legitimately represents more like 30 hours of pve, to be honest.

Sherd
06-07-2011, 20:13
organizing your bags = time.. so either way your arguement involves tedious timesinks. either you spend lots of time meticulously organizing your bags, or you spend a lot of time making the gear bags.. and either way you have to kinda do both. my bag was organized to a degree.. it was as organized as it needed to be for me to find shit.. but it wasn't mega organized .. that would have taken too much time. I'm not the only one who hates the loot system and I'm willing to bet the only people who like it are probably huge fans of uo.

Hrm, yes, i am an UO vet, so to say, lol. But anyhow, I simply can't understand what the problem is. If i have all items i need already in my bank box, it costs me a couple of minuts to prepare a bag. And yes, sometimes I just spend an hour to prepare a batch of bags (but that often also includes crafting an missing item or two). But I might really be quite organized in my bank box (interestingly, in RL i am not that organized). But to complain that finding things it too time consumpting and that one rather would buy new stuff instead of searching for existing stuff ... sounds a bit, sorry, premature.


As for your other point about not pve'ing just because you can buy a pre-made gear bag. I don't understand the logic. It would not wipe out all pve as we know it. People would still need to farm for materials/drops/gold.

If I buy pre-made gear bags from an npc, why would i PvE for weapons or armor or regs? Why would i buy that all from player vendors or even, why should i go through all the hassle to craft it by myself?
Yes, there would still be things which are not covered by those gear bags - like ship modules, etc. But I hope you get my point here.

A solution i would be more than perfectly fine with, would be a strengthened player run economy. May that include auction houses or whatnot - that we don't need to discuss here. Then let players(!) sell pre-assembled sets of different items! Let players disassemble items and re-use the materials. then make vendors BUY stuff from people - so you could just dump all your loot to that player vendor and thus pay for a fresh made gear bag (which the vendor owner had made out of the scavenged crap loot).

that way, PvE guys can PvE all day long, Crafters can craft day and night and you PvPers can continously smash heads. :)

Friends Forever
06-07-2011, 20:18
Well I feel like if you have less time to play then pvp in less gear or cheaper gear. Less time to farm, cheaper gear, less of a loss when you lose.

Also I've been wanting NPC city player vendors that people rent for a period of time. It would be a good incentive for people to stay blue vs being red. Get rid of being able to heal and buff reds without going grey and NPC would be a lot safer.

rikilii
06-07-2011, 20:22
I think this legitimately represents more like 30 hours of pve, to be honest.

It comes out to about 170-200k worth of mats, not counting the cost of the regs/arrows (another 17k), iron, catalysts or gold used in crafting.

That is certainly doable in 10 hours assuming you never get PKed, but not exactly easy for the average player.

TheHamburglar
06-07-2011, 21:46
So you got:
35 q4 Eye
35 q4 Tooth
35 q4 Venomsac
70 q4 Cinder
35 q4 Dtaint
35 q4 Bile
35 q4 Horn
35 q4 Quartz
14 q5 Taint of Khamset
14 Beastman Tooth
21 Dwarf Heart
7 Selentine Ingot
7 Neithal Ingot
14 Veilron Ingot

plus all the iron you would need in 10 hours? I call BS. That's conservatively 10k/hr in skins alone, not including gold (or travel time).

(I'm sure your response will be, 'I already had most of this in my bank.' But you see, my young friend, that doesn't count. You still farmed it at some point.)

if you must know i did 4 hours at the minos/cairn giants, got around 45k gold 12 runestones 2pshards and about 30-40 q4 horn 30-40 q4 tooth and 20 q4 eyes +a few leen/neith keys (which i havent turned in yet)

i did the neithal golem/wildtribe mages for around 2 hours netting about 15 neithal and tons of iron ore, q3/4/5 mats and something like 10k gold.

about another 2 hours at the earth eles/selentine/raptors earnt me about 15 selentine and alot of q3 quartz aswell as about 20-30 q4 claws

and finally 1 hour of rotating celestials and fire elementals netted me 200 q3 cinder and 20 q4 lifeforce.

from these mats and gold i traded and crafted my way to 7 bags.

needless to say spending this much time pveing i got more pvp that most people :)

its all very well theorycrafting and crying on the boards but if you actually get ingame and try it youll find its quite easy.

TheHamburglar
06-07-2011, 21:53
more on topic:

>People that are saying it takes time to actually assemble a bag? sort out your bloody bank. I have a bag for armour, with sub bags for armour type. All items are stacked up so i dont have to sort through. I have a bag for weps the very same way. One for food and drink etc etc. Spend like 30mins one day while cooking fish to sort your bank and it will make your like 100000x easier in the future.

>I agree though that PLAYER vendors should be able to sell bags of items. So in theory i agree that if i had a vendor, i should be able to sell a bag containing a set of gear, 100ea reg 100 arrows and weps/mounts for whatever price i deem suitable.
>I DONT AGREE that an npc vendor should be able to do this as it further hinders the crafting/trading community of this game.

paxprobellum
06-07-2011, 22:23
its all very well theorycrafting and crying on the boards but if you actually get ingame and try it youll find its quite easy.

Actually, you'll find that if you actually do the math, your numbers are impossible. You may just spend a lot more time PvEing than you realize (because it's engaging/enjoyable/etc.) -- so do I.

As one example, it takes 3h 47m (on average) to get 15 neithal/selentine ore (if you're killing the golem as soon as it comes up). If you get really lucky with skins, maybe 3 hours flat.

Also, even if I did believe your times were accurate, you are still 24350 gold short if you are planning to buy all the mats you didn't farm. Because you can apparently farm 12k/hr with no problem, let's say that's 2 extra hours.

The reason I'm posting this is to prove the general point that the farm-to-fight ratio is not what you are claiming (even if you think it is okay). I still stand by my previous statement that this much farming would take about 30 hours on average, including travel time (but NOT including time/aggravation necessary to trade/buy mats you didn't farm).

TheHamburglar
06-07-2011, 22:36
Actually, you'll find that if you actually do the math, your numbers are impossible. You may just spend a lot more time PvEing than you realize (because it's engaging/enjoyable/etc.) -- so do I.

As one example, it takes 3h 47m (on average) to get 15 neithal/selentine ore (if you're killing the golem as soon as it comes up). If you get really lucky with skins, maybe 3 hours flat.

Also, even if I did believe your times were accurate, you are still 24350 gold short if you are planning to buy all the mats you didn't farm. Because you can apparently farm 12k/hr with no problem, let's say that's 2 extra hours.

The reason I'm posting this is to prove the general point that the farm-to-fight ratio is not what you are claiming (even if you think it is okay). I still stand by my previous statement that this much farming would take about 30 hours on average, including travel time (but NOT including time/aggravation necessary to trade/buy mats you didn't farm).

its all relative 15 neithal took me like 6 or 7 golems (yes they drop 4 ore) and the respawn is 15mins and they die in the time it takes me to eat a fish food. Also you have no idea at what price i bought the mats for or sold mine. For example i was trading runestones for q4 mats which (considering i got 12) payed for almost all my q4 mats.

At the end of the day im not gonna argue figures with you - the bags i made were Decent and well worth the time spent on them as if i had been a cheapskate and opted for cheaper bags i could have made them quicker.

EDIT: i do realise your point tho, it would take other people longer to farm this and maybe i was lucky with some of the drops, but the point stands that the time taken to make a cheap readybag all purpose pvp kit is minimal.

ALSO: im "good?" at pve.. i use decent gear (for example i used crafted q4 jbs i made at the start to farm the minos) and q3 transmute bows. I always pve in light pvp gear and manage my stats/stay buffed/use major pots etc so when pvp does come my way i normally kill the people attacking.

Njai
06-07-2011, 22:39
Actually, you'll find that if you actually do the math, your numbers are impossible. You may just spend a lot more time PvEing than you realize (because it's engaging/enjoyable/etc.) -- so do I.

As one example, it takes 3h 47m (on average) to get 15 neithal/selentine ore (if you're killing the golem as soon as it comes up). If you get really lucky with skins, maybe 3 hours flat.

Also, even if I did believe your times were accurate, you are still 24350 gold short if you are planning to buy all the mats you didn't farm. Because you can apparently farm 12k/hr with no problem, let's say that's 2 extra hours.

The reason I'm posting this is to prove the general point that the farm-to-fight ratio is not what you are claiming (even if you think it is okay). I still stand by my previous statement that this much farming would take about 30 hours on average, including travel time (but NOT including time/aggravation necessary to trade/buy mats you didn't farm).

There is too much downtime in the game. I don't want it to be super easy but def not what it is now. The main annoying part is actually gathering the pieces and making the bags. Farming part is reasonable but getting it crafted/crafting/finding the pieces are the annoying and I would like a more streamlined way of creating a actual bag. If I had to choose between what some people wanted which I think would be far too casual and what we have now, most of the time I would take the crap we got now.

With that being said, many people have alliance price ore/gear which is very easy to obtain and a lot of people that don't know this will obviously complain about things that are impossible. It doesn't even make sense why people are arguing about the time it takes to gather gear because even a casual player will obtain gear from pvp in some way unless they somehow die every single time they go to pvp and NEVER kill anyone.

tldr: Downtime currently sucks AV is dumb it wont change, some ideas make it too easy, i rather stick with this crap downtime then making combat "meaningless". Part of DF fun is the adrenaline not only because of combat but the fact that you can lose pixels.

PS: Bows def need to be cheaper!

TheHamburglar
06-07-2011, 22:52
tldr: Downtime currently sucks AV is dumb it wont change, some ideas make it too easy, i rather stick with this crap downtime then making combat "meaningless". Part of DF fun is the adrenaline not only because of combat but the fact that you can lose pixels.

PS: Bows def need to be cheaper!

pretty much hit the nail on the head. If stuff is easy to get - it becomes meaningless. Just like how its not the same buzz when you kill someone thats in a robe and when you kill someone in full infernal

rikilii
06-07-2011, 23:00
I don't agree with the OP's suggestion, but it would be great if AV would introduce conveniences to make gearing up less tedious, for example:


special bags with separate slots for each item typically found in a gear bag that can be autofilled from your bank, kind of like the paper doll with extra slots for regs, potions, sword and board, etc.,



ability assign keybinds to each of those slots to avoid having to drag each item to your hotbar.



allow player vendors to sell bags of items (including bags like the ones mentioned above), as previously mentioned.



fix the damn bag-jumble bug.

It also wouldn't hurt to reduce the farm-to-fight ratio, which could be done simply by messing with some back-end numbers (e.g. increase rare ore drop rates a bit, and make enchants only take 2 or 3 of each mat, instead of 5).

All that said, one thing that's being forgotten here is that gear you lose in PVP doesn't just disappear from the game. An average PVPer should be getting as many gear bags as he loses. I can't tell you how many times I've lost gear in one raid, only to get it back in another one a few days later (and I'm a way below-average PVPer). Obviously below average PVPers will need to work harder in PVE to keep up with their gear, but it just so happens that PVE is a good way to raise your skills. How convenient, right?

ting1
06-07-2011, 23:36
I agree, something needs to change with ready bags. Most darkfall players will say they use too much of online time just staring at their bank or making ready bags.
Introduce a scavenging skill and somehow make it so that all non enchanted armor parts (aka "fillers") wont find their way into the peoples bank anymore.

Rahkim
06-08-2011, 06:50
open all 5-10 ready bags that you're making

Open your bag of greatswords, put one in each ready bag. Close greatsword bag. Takes 5 seconds. Do the same with your bow bag, and your staff bag. Do it with each armor piece. Do it for mounts, and shields. Shift+drag sulfur, type 100, click ok into each bag. Do that for the other regs/arrows/food. I don't understand how this can take people so long....

The time to acquire gear can be debated, but the time it takes to put together several ready bags should be minimal.

TheHamburglar
06-08-2011, 09:36
open all 5-10 ready bags that you're making

Open your bag of greatswords, put one in each ready bag. Close greatsword bag. Takes 5 seconds. Do the same with your bow bag, and your staff bag. Do it with each armor piece. Do it for mounts, and shields. Shift+drag sulfur, type 100, click ok into each bag. Do that for the other regs/arrows/food. I don't understand how this can take people so long....

The time to acquire gear can be debated, but the time it takes to put together several ready bags should be minimal.

thats what i thought... then someone told me about the guys that dribble on their keyboards and lick their screens that just put everything on the main screen and dont use bags >.<

Makgyver
06-08-2011, 11:48
horrible idea, go away!

grizzlednutz
06-08-2011, 14:35
no you guys are right. it's fine the way it is. if players don't like making bag after bag they need to l2p. besides, the population is rising and after summer the game is gonna be jumpin with new players eager to sift through bags of unorganized shit so they can throw it into other bags over and over and over again. it builds character and it's a great feature.

Makgyver
06-08-2011, 14:55
no you guys are right. it's fine the way it is. if players don't like making bag after bag they need to l2p. besides, the population is rising and after summer the game is gonna be jumpin with new players eager to sift through bags of unorganized shit so they can throw it into other bags over and over and over again. it builds character and it's a great feature.
http://store.steampowered.com/app/10/

Thank me later

Aha Toro
06-08-2011, 15:11
no you guys are right. it's fine the way it is. if players don't like making bag after bag they need to l2p. besides, the population is rising and after summer the game is gonna be jumpin with new players eager to sift through bags of unorganized shit so they can throw it into other bags over and over and over again. it builds character and it's a great feature.

I don't know what game these people think they're playing, however, I know that I subbed to Bagfall Online.

I think there are more important issues that should be addressed prior to inventory time syncs.

Kelsen
06-08-2011, 17:18
i would like to just drag a bag to my paper doll and have it equip all armor ;)

meshane
06-11-2011, 01:23
I'm totally against the 'bag' idea. Also totally against making crafting quicker and against making anything easier. They've already given us ridiculously simple methods for raising our stats and such. This game is how its supposed to be... slow, tedious, time consuming, frustrating and in the end, rewarding. I played another mmo for 8 years and left it to come to DF because they (my old game) took what was once difficult and made it insanely easy. I spent months trying to get one character to the max level, more months trying to properly 'template' it and even more months fine tuning abilities and gear. Several years later due to the 'instant gratification' mindset of the majority of cattle... all of my achievements could be attained by new players in a matter of 12 hours or less. That ruined the game for me. If real life were the way these people want it to be, we'd grow up from birth through college in a matter of weeks, instantly have access to buy a house, and everyone would have a job and a car (hauntingly similar to political agenda's of the past wouldn't you say?). Leave the game alone, no resizing the map, no making anything 'easier or faster', fix the glitches and current flaws and stop hackers. maybe THEN and ONLY THEN, introduce some new content.

grizzlednutz
06-11-2011, 13:24
I'm totally against the 'bag' idea. Also totally against making crafting quicker and against making anything easier. They've already given us ridiculously simple methods for raising our stats and such. This game is how its supposed to be... slow, tedious, time consuming, frustrating and in the end, rewarding. I played another mmo for 8 years and left it to come to DF because they (my old game) took what was once difficult and made it insanely easy. I spent months trying to get one character to the max level, more months trying to properly 'template' it and even more months fine tuning abilities and gear. Several years later due to the 'instant gratification' mindset of the majority of cattle... all of my achievements could be attained by new players in a matter of 12 hours or less. That ruined the game for me. If real life were the way these people want it to be, we'd grow up from birth through college in a matter of weeks, instantly have access to buy a house, and everyone would have a job and a car (hauntingly similar to political agenda's of the past wouldn't you say?). Leave the game alone, no resizing the map, no making anything 'easier or faster', fix the glitches and current flaws and stop hackers. maybe THEN and ONLY THEN, introduce some new content.

wow you have been playing df for so long. your critisizm is spot on. game is fine.

Skilla
06-11-2011, 13:32
I made myself 40 ready bags in the last 3 days, You should try that, its painful but when your done you wont have to do it in a long time.

Aha Toro
06-11-2011, 16:12
I don't like this idea, however, I like the suggestion that players should be able to sell ready bags on their npc vendors.