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RealDeal
03-07-2010, 05:16
When people get an account banned from the game, why are they allowed back into the game if they buy a new account?

AV makes money cause they BUY a new account, then they get banned AGAIN for cheating, then they BUY another NEW account.

Catch the drift?

giantAppleCore
03-07-2010, 09:34
ok well maybe you cant go to jail but still be sued for all your money

Geez, stop. You wont get sued for any money, it would be laughed out of a courtroom. The creator of hacks maybe, but a user? Please. Blizzard would have another huge revenue stream. You're talking out of your ass and it's tired.

TheVillageIdiot
03-07-2010, 10:44
lol youre stupid, first of all, everything you wrote had nothing to do with my statement that breach of contract is indeed a crime in most countries in the world. and im laughing my ass off at all you stupid kids thinking that breach of contract isnt against the law...and now you all are trying to make up some stories as an excuse for your ridiculous statements lol.

and you said it yourself, they give out your personal information in the case of you breaking a law. (as mentioned in the user agreement)

btw lol at you losing 400 bucks for an aoc account


breach of contract is actually what is called a "tort". A tort claim is different than criminal law in nearly all countries.

Corp-Por
03-07-2010, 12:11
im a new player to the game and i have had all kinds of ppl telling me that AFK grinding of stats is OK in the open world not inside npc cities. then i also have ppl telling me that if you do that and get caught you get banned. there is too much misinformation out there for new players and i havent been able to find anything about this subject so far on the forums. *still looking* would be nice if some folx would explain what is actually going on with AV and its position on AFK grinding. im at a loss.


This confusion occurred because at launch a year ago a lot of players were macroing in starter towns, the AV then came out with a statement saying macroing within tower range, that later turned in to out right ban on any macroing,hence the mixed message you received, but the current stance is, any macroing is a bannable offence.

Dr Fuenke
03-07-2010, 12:56
AV makes money cause they BUY a new account, then they get banned AGAIN for cheating, then they BUY another NEW account.

Catch the drift?

This.


Amusing how he is trying to save face after being so sure earlier. If every company that had some users disobeying the TOS, should sue them court rooms would be booked every day.

Dr Fuenke
03-07-2010, 12:57
Originally Posted by xerian View Post
When people get an account banned from the game, why are they allowed back into the game if they buy a new account?
AV makes money cause they BUY a new account, then they get banned AGAIN for cheating, then they BUY another NEW account.

This was what I was quoting btw not the other quote.

stony23
03-07-2010, 14:38
Geez, stop. You wont get sued for any money, it would be laughed out of a courtroom. The creator of hacks maybe, but a user? Please. Blizzard would have another huge revenue stream. You're talking out of your ass and it's tired.

im talking about breach of contract, if you do that you can be sued for all your money

stony23
03-07-2010, 14:39
breach of contract is actually what is called a "tort". A tort claim is different than criminal law in nearly all countries.

ok i did a mistake there, still you can be sued for a lot of money

johnnyc3po
03-07-2010, 15:35
lol youre stupid, first of all, everything you wrote had nothing to do with my statement that breach of contract is indeed a crime in most countries in the world. and im laughing my ass off at all you stupid kids thinking that breach of contract isnt against the law...and now you all are trying to make up some stories as an excuse for your ridiculous statements lol.

and you said it yourself, they give out your personal information in the case of you breaking a law. (as mentioned in the user agreement)

btw lol at you losing 400 bucks for an aoc account

Not always, the contract may not have been legal to begin with. It's like a non-compete contract that you sign when you work for a tech company, dis-allowing you to work for a competitor for a year after employment with your current company. At least in New York state, those do not hold up in court.

Dr Fuenke
03-07-2010, 16:02
im talking about breach of contract, if you do that you can be sued for all your money

First of all you can't get sued for all your money. Second of all, with all the paperwork and time involved in such a case (Which I have been through personally several times) , there is simply no lucrative reason to do so for a company, unless they stand to win a lot of money.

stony23
03-07-2010, 22:13
case closed

ExcursionRob
03-08-2010, 01:03
I say post a Perma Ban list with the Name of Every person that has been Perma banned. I bet alot of the "Retired" names people know will be on that perma ban list...

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03-08-2010, 07:01
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hitandmiss
03-08-2010, 15:55
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Couldnt agree more....

Funny how if you go into any of the new armor threads and say they look sh1t or ask why they wasting there time on armor no one cares about ur message is deleted, Ad for porn or junk and they just bann u....

tehWise
03-19-2010, 14:53
You guys obviously aren't catching radar hackers.

My understanding of the radar hack and wall hack is that they're client side, so no information is sent to the servers for your system to check.

The only way to catch radar users would be for actual members of AV to login to the game WITH radar and run around the map. They'd see dots coming towards them from the sides or front and be able to move in a different direction, if the dots change course as well, and they're not within distance to see/hear you in game, then you know they're using radar.

I'm about ready to test it out myself if I don't see improvement.

EKS
03-19-2010, 14:58
You guys obviously aren't catching radar hackers.

My understanding of the radar hack and wall hack is that they're client side, so no information is sent to the servers for your system to check.

The only way to catch radar users would be for actual members of AV to login to the game WITH radar and run around the map. They'd see dots coming towards them from the sides or front and be able to move in a different direction, if the dots change course as well, and they're not within distance to see/hear you in game, then you know they're using radar.

I'm about ready to test it out myself if I don't see improvement.
...................
you clearly dont understand how anti cheat works. Most games run code on the client that looks at what is in memory and then finds the cheat on he client ( Explained simply ).

extant1
03-19-2010, 15:00
Two wrongs don't make a right, listen to your mother.

Ginger Magician
03-19-2010, 15:03
I have recently come across 2 radar/wall hackers.

It is clear that AV have absolutely no means of catching or detecting these type of hacks and they are becoming even more common.

What can be done about it I dont know but when you are jumped from behind by one of these hackers without making the slightest sound or visual indication as to your position it is pretty annoying.

Drasked
03-19-2010, 15:08
When people get an account banned from the game, why are they allowed back into the game if they buy a new account?

Profit?

Sarphus
03-19-2010, 15:12
They're obviously not stopping all hackers either.

We laid a siege on a neighboring clan. We put one of the siege stones under the red dragon spawn.

Just before the siege a hacker stickybacked the dragon (coincidence? hell no). I paged a GM on them. I didn't get a GM response and the hacker killed the dragon. It took him a very long time to kill the dragon and no GM even responded to me.

When stuff like that happens, I makes me question the usefulness of GMs. They had probably 30+ minutes to go ban the hacker and they didn't even respond. This was during primetime hours!

Corp-Por
03-19-2010, 15:41
They're obviously not stopping all hackers either.

We laid a siege on a neighboring clan. We put one of the siege stones under the red dragon spawn.

Just before the siege a hacker stickybacked the dragon (coincidence? hell no). I paged a GM on them. I didn't get a GM response and the hacker killed the dragon. It took him a very long time to kill the dragon and no GM even responded to me.

When stuff like that happens, I makes me question the usefulness of GMs. They had probably 30+ minutes to go ban the hacker and they didn't even respond. This was during primetime hours!

Those trail accounts a proving a bitch with the hacker problem, it didn't help either for a smug dev team member on the forums to give a heads up to hackers they're making a link between main account and an abused trail account on the same credit card, did they even consider that the topped up credit card you can buy over the counter?

Hackers have no issue using other a separate billing method not linking them to their main account. The need to raise the cost of trail account 5 US and 5EU, at least hackers can give the dev team more money that can pay a GM whose jobs to to only answer hacker reports.

Sarphus
03-19-2010, 16:08
Those trail accounts a proving a bitch with the hacker problem, it didn't help either for a smug dev team member on the forums to give a heads up to hackers they're making a link between main account and an abused trail account on the same credit card, did they even consider that the topped up credit card you can buy over the counter?

Hackers have no issue using other a separate billing method not linking them to their main account. The need to raise the cost of trail account 5 US and 5EU, at least hackers can give the dev team more money that can pay a GM whose jobs to to only answer hacker reports.

My problem with what happened is that for them to fail to ban someone who is stickybacking a dragon they have to not even be trying.

It concerns me when the gms are all gung-ho about enforcing policy on some people and appear completely aloof at other times. I don't know if this is a corruption issue, poor trianing or laziness. All I know is that it should not take 30+ minutes to teleport to a dragon and see a guy stickybacking it.

Hell, they should have checks in place that look for people doing melee damage to red dragons. You can't legitimately melee a red dragon to death.

Flap Jack
03-19-2010, 16:20
To annoy ppl AFK swimming by killing them and robbing them of their vitality gains. It worked fine before u changed it...

This is true, I don't see the big deal about afk swimming. People go around on rafts all the time picking off afk swimmers :P

Dragoon
03-19-2010, 16:30
I have recently come across 2 radar/wall hackers.

It is clear that AV have absolutely no means of catching or detecting these type of hacks and they are becoming even more common.

What can be done about it I dont know but when you are jumped from behind by one of these hackers without making the slightest sound or visual indication as to your position it is pretty annoying.

AV has no cheat detection whatsoever. You can still download radar hacks and other Darkfall cheats for FREE by searching the web. There are people around who have been hacking since release. I know people who got bored with the game and would blatantly hack in an obvious manner and they still wouldn't get banned.

I don't understand why they don't just lock thread this thread, it's a farce and everyone knows it.

L-C
03-19-2010, 16:51
AV has no cheat detection whatsoever. You can still download radar hacks and other Darkfall cheats for FREE by searching the web. There are people around who have been hacking since release. I know people who got bored with the game and would blatantly hack in an obvious manner and they still wouldn't get banned.

I don't understand why they don't just lock thread this thread, it's a farce and everyone knows it.

We have a naked guy teleporting inside our mine multiple times every day to steal ore. He has been reported every day. We haven't gotten any kind of response, and he just keeps coming.

ExcursionRob
03-19-2010, 17:00
They're obviously not stopping all hackers either.

We laid a siege on a neighboring clan. We put one of the siege stones under the red dragon spawn.

Just before the siege a hacker stickybacked the dragon (coincidence? hell no). I paged a GM on them. I didn't get a GM response and the hacker killed the dragon. It took him a very long time to kill the dragon and no GM even responded to me.

When stuff like that happens, I makes me question the usefulness of GMs. They had probably 30+ minutes to go ban the hacker and they didn't even respond. This was during primetime hours!

The dude stickey backing the Dragon is probably in the same guild as the GM that happened to be Responsible for answering petitions that day and he probably didnt feel comfortable Banning the SG of his own clan....

Early Grace
03-19-2010, 17:00
my mount was stolen by a teleport hacker 20 minutes ago. Good job AV.

Skilla
03-19-2010, 19:00
The dude stickey backing the Dragon is probably in the same guild as the GM that happened to be Responsible for answering petitions that day and he probably didnt feel comfortable Banning the SG of his own clan....

sad thing is that's probably true.

Deerhunter
03-19-2010, 19:07
AV has no cheat detection whatsoever. You can still download radar hacks and other Darkfall cheats for FREE by searching the web. There are people around who have been hacking since release. I know people who got bored with the game and would blatantly hack in an obvious manner and they still wouldn't get banned.

I don't understand why they don't just lock thread this thread, it's a farce and everyone knows it.


100% correct there. I know for a fact 2 people reported for teleporting a few months back are STILL in game on their toons. These toons are played every day and both instances it was NOT lag. The guys were surrounded totally both time and then just vanished out of thin air......

gheybaby
03-20-2010, 11:59
AV's cheat detection is apparently user fraps on youtube.

Nekota-san
03-20-2010, 13:56
I have a question... If u check ppl for afk do u do it with a simple /tell only? Cuz thats retarded.. half the time i dont have my chat up while playing and the times i actually see it i usually dont see the added tabs that pop out from /tells until usually 30 mins/1h after i get em :P so if u macrocheck throu t/tells u are just retarded :P IF u want to control it ATLEAST make a proper check

foojin
03-20-2010, 14:22
AV's cheat detection is apparently user fraps on youtube.

Not even that, users with cheats posting vids didn't receive a ban...

Deerhunter
03-20-2010, 15:18
I have a question... If u check ppl for afk do u do it with a simple /tell only? Cuz thats retarded.. half the time i dont have my chat up while playing and the times i actually see it i usually dont see the added tabs that pop out from /tells until usually 30 mins/1h after i get em :P so if u macrocheck throu t/tells u are just retarded :P IF u want to control it ATLEAST make a proper check

Hah - there are macro scripts out there that answer GM tells now, lol THey need to ask them a simple math question to confirm they are not AFK now....

bongloads
03-21-2010, 08:50
AV:

High priority (along with multicore/dx11 support) should be fixing radar/see-thru-wall hackers. I pay you, you don't pay me, so I'll let you come up with the how.

Xaero
03-22-2010, 20:47
There has been much speculation within the Darkfall community on what really happens to exploiters and cheaters. We checked with Darkfall’s Customer Support department and this is what we found out:

There was a post after a mass ban (http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=182316&highlight=cheaters) last April where it was explained how the system works and how violations are cross referenced and double-checked. Since then there have been many further improvements to the detection systems. There are programmers dedicated to the creation of tools and detection technologies and there are also dedicated support personnel for the investigation of offending accounts. Recently there have been major improvements to detection technologies and to GM tools to prepare for the Darkfall trial.

We may not hear about it all the time, but the Darkfall Support team has been diligently and silently enforcing Darkfall’s anti-cheat and exploit policies. To date, over 1300 accounts have been permanently banned. The community has often asked for cheater’s names to be publicized. Aventurine’s management does not like the idea of discussing bans or naming names. They believe that it’s enough to permanently ban the cheater at the customer level. Aside from the principle of the matter, there’s also a practical issue. Most cheaters create multiple characters on their accounts, sometimes even hundreds. This is apparently done in an effort to confuse the GMs but that’s not the way the system works.

Aventurine has a no tolerance policy towards cheating. Bans happen at the customer, account, and billing level. The Darkfall trial which went live last Wednesday gave some players an inexpensive way of creating accounts to cheat with. These players have unfortunately also had their main accounts permanently banned, along with their credit information, and in some cases our billing department had to contact Paypal, or their credit institutions and ISPs on their activities.

There’s another misconception about cheating: Some cheaters believe that if they are not conspicuous, they will avoid a ban. That’s not how the system works. If you use third party programs to cheat with, you will be detected and you'll get a permanent ban.

Aventurine takes cheating and exploiting very seriously and there's a lot of work being done at the development and the support level to continuously improve measures and to enforce policies to keep cheaters out of the game.

That's a net loss of 234k a year for Darkfall. On top of that the trial hackers cause people to quit, even if they are able to target just one person which adds to the net loss. Detection software and bans are not a solution, its a band-aid. One person hacking can cause 5 or 6 trial accounts to never sub. The software holes need to be fixed on the game will not reach its potential.

FastEddy
03-22-2010, 21:08
O nvm i still have hope

Jedicake
03-22-2010, 21:27
Ok that's nice I don't give a shit, now start temp banning afk swimmers and afk runners please, or else my gm_reports are fucking useless

Valaska
03-22-2010, 22:11
That's a net loss of 234k a year for Darkfall. On top of that the trial hackers cause people to quit, even if they are able to target just one person which adds to the net loss. Detection software and bans are not a solution, its a band-aid. One person hacking can cause 5 or 6 trial accounts to never sub. The software holes need to be fixed on the game will not reach its potential.

Uhm, it bans the account/IP they said, so IP address.

BrittneySpears
03-22-2010, 22:18
This is why AV put in guard towers in hamlets and cities, so people could macro.

McDoogs
03-22-2010, 22:20
radar is still undetected fyi

TheVillageIdiot
03-22-2010, 23:46
radar is still undetected fyi

it is only un-detectable if the application displays the information outside the game.

If the information is displayed on the hud it IS detectable, however it may take a bit of time to review the the screen captures and ban the culprit.

If you read the cheat forums a few people have reported getting banned for radar usage.

FastEddy
03-22-2010, 23:58
Ive read the cheat forums.

No one has gotten banned for radar hacking.

ChinaCat
03-23-2010, 00:12
Ive read the cheat forums.

No one has gotten banned for radar hacking.

Perhaps he has access to forums you don't. Always thought that Villiage dude was a shady character -)

FastEddy
03-23-2010, 00:29
he doesnt

I have seen the highest level of forums (there was a bug) and through all the threads on there, not a word of radar hacking.

Ighox
03-23-2010, 02:35
it is only un-detectable if the application displays the information outside the game.

If the information is displayed on the hud it IS detectable, however it may take a bit of time to review the the screen captures and ban the culprit.

If you read the cheat forums a few people have reported getting banned for radar usage.

Radar hack simply reads the information in the client and displays it in a directx overlay inside the Darkfall window.
Without client side detection you just can't detect it.
And there is no client side detection.

And yes if you read the cheat forums a few people have reported getting banned for radar, just as anyone that gets banned for hacking tells their friends that he got banned for macroing, that AV made a mistake, that he never even afk-gathered and at least did not hack.

FastEddy
03-23-2010, 03:10
i dont know what cheat forums yall are talking about.

The ones I am talking about are where the GMs posts who they are suspicious of and if they were eventually banned.

Bustafoo
03-29-2010, 16:25
.....I just got banned for standing behind a building that u can walk around....I wasnt even casting behind it....I was just standing their....and I got banned for exploiting geometry for 3 days....for nothing....as if the population isnt low enough all ready...AV wants to remove more paying customers and offend the only loyal player base they have....GG AV keep up the shitty job...

DAA KAPUTTMACHA
03-29-2010, 16:31
.....i just got banned for standing behind a building that u can walk around....i wasnt even casting behind it....i was just standing their....and i got banned for exploiting geometry for 3 days....for nothing....as if the population isnt low enough all ready...av wants to remove more paying customers and offend the only loyal player base they have....gg av keep up the shitty job...

us1?

Ezar
03-29-2010, 17:13
i dont know what cheat forums yall are talking about.

The ones I am talking about are where the GMs posts who they are suspicious of and if they were eventually banned.

How did you access those? :p

FastEddy
03-29-2010, 19:37
there was a bug that me and about 5 other people found out about.

Back when you could first link your forums account to your ingame account it gave you access to the entire forums (including the hidden forums).

Like a good person that had faith in AV I reported it instantly and they took the forums down shortly there after.

Valaska
03-29-2010, 22:06
Anyone else think the title sounds like they are enforcing you to cheat?

TheVillageIdiot
03-29-2010, 22:52
Radar hack simply reads the information in the client and displays it in a directx overlay inside the Darkfall window.
Without client side detection you just can't detect it.
And there is no client side detection.

And yes if you read the cheat forums a few people have reported getting banned for radar, just as anyone that gets banned for hacking tells their friends that he got banned for macroing, that AV made a mistake, that he never even afk-gathered and at least did not hack.

This is detected by taking a snapshot of the client screen and uploading it to the server for later review.

I have no idea if AV does this but it is certainly detectable (manually).

However, I have been in enough ambushes to think that not many people are using radar hacks. If they were, they would have seen us.

hengle
03-30-2010, 00:00
No, the problem is how american parents raise their kids.

always some turd from EU sayin something about america. drop the envy already, america is a shit nation, you have nothing to be jealous of.

hengle
03-30-2010, 00:18
post your imaginary "tons of proof" for me...if you have an issue with some write a support ticket.

i talked to some GMs and i very well know what is allowed and what not and they all were 100% consistent and all my friends told me exactly the same outcome of their conversations with GMs.

so you come up with your conspiracy theory that GMs have different views of what should be punished with a ban and what not....and i should come up with evidence now that youre wrong or im a troll?

dude, get a grip on reality


nerd who considers himself elite in a video game telling someone to get a grip on reality. thanks lol i needed a laugh.

Ezar
03-30-2010, 17:20
This is detected by taking a snapshot of the client screen and uploading it to the server for later review.

I have no idea if AV does this but it is certainly detectable (manually).

However, I have been in enough ambushes to think that not many people are using radar hacks. If they were, they would have seen us.

Spyware, breach of privacy, etc.

There's limits in what a legit application can do you know.

FastEddy
03-30-2010, 19:19
I thought the damn cheating programs were overlays and you screenshot the game all day long but it wouldnt matter because its like having fraps running.

It isnt actually in the game just on top of the screen.

slakjaw
04-01-2010, 17:01
How do you say "PunkBuster" in greek?




And why do people call AFK swimming macroing?

Macroing swimming must be diving and coming up for air or something.

An AFK swimmer is just a target to be killed.
The skills you gain from it are very low.
And when you die you waste a whole day of AFK swimming and the killer gets alignment.

The more afk swimmers the more AFK killers!!!

And, the people that are banned for such a simple act as AFK swimming are doing it where they shouldnt be, like in NPC citys.

You will get warned for AFK running and swimming ect... before getting banned.

It's your own damn fault for AFKing a skill in public areas and effecting others by sound and bad rep for the game newcomers seeing it.

If you are "Macroing" and are reported you will get banned.

People on here really should correct their terms between the 2.

Ones serious and one is lightly tolerated.



A complaint = a strike on an account too by the way.

1 complaint about someone isnt going to raise alot of attention, just a tick.

As the complaints add up there is reason to investigate.




Oh ya, how do you say "PunkBuster" in greek?

Pretty sure PunkBuster gets rid of speedhacks!!!



And 1 more thing, where the F@#K are the patch notes again!!!
How many times do we have to complain about not posting the patch notes til after the patch, and on the damn login server screen.

Not sure why this cant be figured out LOL.

RonarcBracklaw
04-01-2010, 17:31
Displaying the corpses of criminals was an excellent way to keep the public from committing crimes, as the average citizen could see the horrible punishment for crimes and would know that the laws were being enforced.

Displaying the corpses of wrongfully executed citizens or advertising that you have jailed a large number of innocent people for 3 days does little but cause unrest.

Can you see why implementing this would be bad for a kingdom that has no clear laws, rarely enforces it's only defined laws, and relies on the opinions of law enforcement officials to be judge and sentence "criminals" would be a bad idea?

qft

giantAppleCore
04-01-2010, 17:45
I thought the damn cheating programs were overlays and you screenshot the game all day long but it wouldnt matter because its like having fraps running.

It isnt actually in the game just on top of the screen.

Can someone test this out and post the results?

=)

xarnthal
04-03-2010, 22:59
Please give some proof they actually do something.
Killed yesterday by a speed hacker that stole my mount, ran off and came back with another mount before I had time to loot and skin a corpse.
Killed today by someone who very obviously used radar hacks, as I was resting half inside of something and he found me after about 3 minutes of running around in circles over my head.
Please show some proof to this community that you give a shit AV.

gheybaby
04-03-2010, 23:20
Can someone test this out and post the results?

=)

There was a guy who posted a trade post like a year ago that was a screenshot of his enchanting materials bag. You could see the radar hack running under it. It was pretty funny.

Salous
04-03-2010, 23:33
AV strikes again. With their "cheating Enforcement." Today one of my members, who just started the game a little over a month ago, was banned for "using third party programs." When trying to figure out that reason for the ban, he asked was it because of the G-19 keyboard he uses. They said no. Other then that, all they will say is that he was "cheating." He was banned for cheating/hacking, which has nothing to do with macros. Yet, me and my clan knows he was doing nothing of the sort.

Long story short, AV bans people for no reason, will not back up their "reasons" with any sort of proof. Whats the point of playing this game, taking all the time to grind up characters, if they are just going to ban any of us, without a reason and without proof?

Good job running off players AV. I hope some Turkish company comes and Blitzkriegs the shit out of you and takes what you own... again.

Najik
04-04-2010, 01:40
From the Darfall support page.

- May I use my Logitech G15/G19 to create and use macro's in game?
Article Yes, you are allowed to configure macros with your G15 or G19.
Please note that you are not allowed to use a quick loot script.
Make sure it is not something you wouldn't be able to do normally and avoid using those macros in areas protected by NPC towers.

Deerhunter
04-04-2010, 02:57
There was a guy who posted a trade post like a year ago that was a screenshot of his enchanting materials bag. You could see the radar hack running under it. It was pretty funny.

Do not forget the infamous Dontbanmeagain Orillcry and it took forever for him to get banned even with his own dumbass screenshot....