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Vessol
09-29-2009, 23:45
I know it's Infowars, but not everything they report is fake.

http://www.infowars.com/montana-town-occupied-by-private-paramilitary-security-force/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9cr8BHBMK8

Even if Infowars spin it, WHY is a private company branding black SUVs as Hardin Police and taking over?

But wait. Most of you fucking idiots will go "lol /tinfoil, lulz" and not even read it.

I have a friend who lives in Billings Montana, we went to school back together in Bozeman Montana. I left him a message to see if he can see if any of this is true. Even if the local news reported on it, you all will say that is fake and a conspiracy theory.

Lord Bulleteus
09-30-2009, 00:02
last month i saw many stories about the army deploying around the entire USA also foreign troops that are supposed to help with civil unrests

wonder whats gona happen

Carnagel
09-30-2009, 00:02
That is strange and slightly chilling

Teth
09-30-2009, 00:04
The sooner we accept that modern democracy is a complete sham affair and just cut straight to having our corporate overlords handling the management of the nation without the pithy veil of "legitimate government" in front of them, the better.

Bring on the cyberpunk future!

Lord Bulleteus
09-30-2009, 00:06
i think the only future we have is anachry or slavery

Honorius
09-30-2009, 00:06
Wolverines!!!!

Teth
09-30-2009, 00:08
i think the only future we have is anachry or slavery
Nah. Societal structures are surprisingly durable things at the lower levels. All I'm saying is that the sooner we accept our Google-Boeing-Haoyuan Heavy Industry megacorporate conglomerate overlords, the sooner we can all get beyond our dashed expectations and start working towards the future.

Vessol
09-30-2009, 00:08
Wolverines!!!!

http://70.32.96.186/files/uploaded-images/wolverines.jpg

xpiher
09-30-2009, 00:10
I'm not going to read the article, but I will say this. After Katrina Black water secured a contract from the united states government to do patrols in New Orleans and protect the French Quarter. This is fact. Why should anyone be surprised if it happens more often? Want to hear something else thats even funnier? THe guy that runs blackwater is a devote catholic convert from evangelical christianity and only uses his billions of dollars to fund republican campaigns. While its his right to do so, he was pretty much Bush's private army commander in Iraq, Afghanistan, and else where.

Honorius
09-30-2009, 00:11
i think the only future we have is anachry or slavery

I'm a descnedant from Caesar which means I'm a descendant of Aphrodite which means I'm part God, worship me.

Vessol
09-30-2009, 00:12
I'm not going to read the article, but I will say this. After Katrina Black water secured a contract from the united states government to do patrols in New Orleans and protect the French Quarter. This is fact. Why should anyone be surprised if it happens more often? Want to hear something else thats even funnier? THe guy that runs blackwater is a devote catholic convert from evangelical christianity and only uses his billions of dollars to fund republican campaigns. While its his right to do so, he was pretty much Bush's private army commander in Iraq, Afghanistan, and else where.

You fail to mention unofficial martial law being declared on New Orleans, guns being confiscated and people being put into a bus station turned into a prison for refusing to evacuate.

You should read the article though.

Also Republican=Democrat. There is no difference now between either party.

Lord Bulleteus
09-30-2009, 00:12
hmm blackwater blood thirsty murderers with the right to kill

Villageninja
09-30-2009, 00:18
Oh lawdy, oh lawdy, dey's is doin bad things. Let's all run 'roun an scream oh lawdy.

Vessol
09-30-2009, 00:20
This isn't Blackwater, or Xe as it is now called.

There are a bunch of these PMCs

http://www.americanpolicegroup.com/

Is the one in Hardin.

“Government contract databases show no record of the company. Security industry representatives and federal officials said they had never heard of it. On its Web site, the company lists as its headquarters a building in Washington near the White House that holds “virtual offices.” A spokeswoman for the building said American Police Force never completed its application to use the address,” reports AP.

Furthermore, APF was tasked with filling the empty Hardin detention center with inmates, without any clear indication of where those prisoners would come from.

“It’s unclear where the company will get the inmates for the jail. Montana says it’s not sending inmates to the jail, and neither are federal officials in the state,” according to the report.

Vessol
09-30-2009, 00:31
"Several media agencies have identified inconsistencies with the company. For instance their website states they have "years of experience," but a company spokesman said the corporation was formed this February. They also list an address to a building in Washington D.C., but no one at that address has ever heard of them. "

http://www.kulr8.com/news/local/59284497.html

"HARDIN, Mont.—After arriving in this rural city with three Mercedes SUVs marked with the logo of a nonexistent police department, representatives of an obscure California security company said preparations were under way to take over Hardin's never-used, $27 million jail. "
http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_13427622?nclick_check=1

Eyrothath
09-30-2009, 00:31
The sooner we accept that modern democracy is a complete sham affair and just cut straight to having our corporate overlords handling the management of the nation without the pithy veil of "legitimate government" in front of them, the better.

Bring on the cyberpunk future!

That's great but the U.S. was never a democracy.. We're a Federal Constitutional Republic..

Nunz
09-30-2009, 00:33
Wolverines!!!!

This

Vessol
09-30-2009, 00:34
That's great but the U.S. was never a democracy.. We're a Federal Constitutional Democratic Republic..

ftfy

Democracy=/=Direct Democracy

Most, if not all modern democracies are representative democracies.

Direct Democracy itself is basically mob rule.



"Several media agencies have identified inconsistencies with the company. For instance their website states they have "years of experience," but a company spokesman said the corporation was formed this February. They also list an address to a building in Washington D.C., but no one at that address has ever heard of them. "

http://www.kulr8.com/news/local/59284497.html

"HARDIN, Mont.—After arriving in this rural city with three Mercedes SUVs marked with the logo of a nonexistent police department, representatives of an obscure California security company said preparations were under way to take over Hardin's never-used, $27 million jail. "
http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_13427622?nclick_check=1


This isn't Blackwater, or Xe as it is now called.

There are a bunch of these PMCs

http://www.americanpolicegroup.com/

Is the one in Hardin.

“Government contract databases show no record of the company. Security industry representatives and federal officials said they had never heard of it. On its Web site, the company lists as its headquarters a building in Washington near the White House that holds “virtual offices.” A spokeswoman for the building said American Police Force never completed its application to use the address,” reports AP.

Furthermore, APF was tasked with filling the empty Hardin detention center with inmates, without any clear indication of where those prisoners would come from.

“It’s unclear where the company will get the inmates for the jail. Montana says it’s not sending inmates to the jail, and neither are federal officials in the state,” according to the report.

Teth
09-30-2009, 00:46
That's great but the U.S. was never a democracy.. We're a Federal Constitutional Republic..
And?

Half these damned forums are always whining that the government should keep its fingers out of private industry affairs because, hey, private industry is way more efficient than government could ever be. So why not turn governance over to the corporations? You could be part of the Microsoft-Starbucks Federated Republic or one of a wide range of quality nation-state products!

Villageninja
09-30-2009, 00:50
And?

Half these damned forums are always whining that the government should keep its fingers out of private industry affairs because, hey, private industry is way more efficient than government could ever be. So why not turn governance over to the corporations? You could be part of the Microsoft-Starbucks Federated Republic or one of a wide range of quality nation-state products!

We'd even get a neat little logo

Teth
09-30-2009, 00:53
We'd even get a neat little logo
You would! As well as discounts for relevant corporate-nation-state-related products. All inhabitants of the MSFR get 10% off purchases of Mocha Frappuchinos and Office 2XYZ!

Serenius
09-30-2009, 01:02
I'm a descnedant from Caesar which means I'm a descendant of Aphrodite which means I'm part God, worship me.

Very very weird that you said that, for me at least since the topic of Caesar being the descendant of Venus came up in discussion today.

Vessol
09-30-2009, 01:05
And?

Half these damned forums are always whining that the government should keep its fingers out of private industry affairs because, hey, private industry is way more efficient than government could ever be. So why not turn governance over to the corporations? You could be part of the Microsoft-Starbucks Federated Republic or one of a wide range of quality nation-state products!

Except who controls the corporations? The Bankers. And who else do they control? The Government.

StrawberryClock
09-30-2009, 01:06
So instead of using their usual tools, the military and police, now they outsource it to another company with the whole contract funded by Americans.

Well pig-yankees, I hope you enjoy paying to get fucked in the ass.

StrawberryClock
09-30-2009, 01:10
When the revolution breaks out, I hope they shoot at the mercs first. Those fuckers need it.

Strangia
09-30-2009, 01:38
The sooner we accept that modern democracy is a complete sham affair and just cut straight to having our corporate overlords handling the management of the nation without the pithy veil of "legitimate government" in front of them, the better.

Bring on the cyberpunk future!

Any democracy is a sham, there has never been democracy, except maybe in ancient germanic tribes, and even then, it was probably somehow corrupt.

Strangia
09-30-2009, 01:39
http://70.32.96.186/files/uploaded-images/wolverines.jpg

Holy shit, my sig!

SSguy
09-30-2009, 02:16
I was interested until I failed to read anything about them detaining people.

Looks like its just one big mixup that has a private police force patrolling a town.

IMO, you need to /tinfoil off

Vessol
09-30-2009, 02:17
Holy shit, my sig!

I was the one who started the Wolverines, dolt. Back when North Korea testing its missile.

Villageninja
09-30-2009, 02:59
1. http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_13427622

2. http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/heather/countdown-hardin-montana-willing-take-fort

Strangia
09-30-2009, 03:09
I was the one who started the Wolverines, dolt. Back when North Korea testing its missile.

I wasn't claiming ownership, i was just pointing out the original Forumfall wolverines.

Sqarak
09-30-2009, 15:47
To All Our Friends Who Want True Liberty!

Guns being confiscated by private militias is perfectly acceptable. In a free society where everyone has a gun. It is the one with the best guns who is going to advise you what to do.
In this case Xe (formerly know as Blackwater) and friends have the best guns and the best resources to free you all from any form of Government.
A handful of gigantic but deeply caring companies will through massive mergers not only provide you with a central source of employment. They will also make sure that you get your electricity, oil, gas, food, drinking-water and medical supplies from a single source.
They will also be very willing to supply you with medical treatment, take care of your housing and make sure that you will enjoy the best entertainment in the world after a long hard day of working.

Thanks to the co-operation between these companies and private militias you will also enjoy 24/7 security from certain Far Left, Liberal, Atheist or Muslim elements in our society.


Do not disagree with our terms of LIBERTY. Only traitors to the cause disagree with our LIBERTY. Traitors are a threat to our LIBERTY, a threat, that will be dealt with! LIBERTY above ALL! NONE above LIBERTY.



Yours truly,

HEADMASTER OF NORSEFIRE COMMUNICATION.

StrawberryClock
10-01-2009, 00:37
To All Our Friends Who Want True Liberty!

Guns being confiscated by private militias is perfectly acceptable. In a free society where everyone has a gun. It is the one with the best guns who is going to advise you what to do.
In this case Xe (formerly know as Blackwater) and friends have the best guns and the best resources to free you all from any form of Government.
A handful of gigantic but deeply caring companies will through massive mergers not only provide you with a central source of employment. They will also make sure that you get your electricity, oil, gas, food, drinking-water and medical supplies from a single source.
They will also be very willing to supply you with medical treatment, take care of your housing and make sure that you will enjoy the best entertainment in the world after a long hard day of working.

Thanks to the co-operation between these companies and private militias you will also enjoy 24/7 security from certain Far Left, Liberal, Atheist or Muslim elements in our society.


Do not disagree with our terms of LIBERTY. Only traitors to the cause disagree with our LIBERTY. Traitors are a threat to our LIBERTY, a threat, that will be dealt with! LIBERTY above ALL! NONE above LIBERTY.



Yours truly,

HEADMASTER OF NORSEFIRE COMMUNICATION.

How and where do I sign up?

Serenius
10-01-2009, 05:04
To All Our Friends Who Want True Liberty!

Guns being confiscated by private militias is perfectly acceptable. In a free society where everyone has a gun. It is the one with the best guns who is going to advise you what to do.
In this case Xe (formerly know as Blackwater) and friends have the best guns and the best resources to free you all from any form of Government.
A handful of gigantic but deeply caring companies will through massive mergers not only provide you with a central source of employment. They will also make sure that you get your electricity, oil, gas, food, drinking-water and medical supplies from a single source.
They will also be very willing to supply you with medical treatment, take care of your housing and make sure that you will enjoy the best entertainment in the world after a long hard day of working.

Thanks to the co-operation between these companies and private militias you will also enjoy 24/7 security from certain Far Left, Liberal, Atheist or Muslim elements in our society.


Do not disagree with our terms of LIBERTY. Only traitors to the cause disagree with our LIBERTY. Traitors are a threat to our LIBERTY, a threat, that will be dealt with! LIBERTY above ALL! NONE above LIBERTY.



Yours truly,

HEADMASTER OF NORSEFIRE COMMUNICATION.

If that means the Christians are gone, I'm in.

DoveAlexa
10-01-2009, 05:35
Nah. Societal structures are surprisingly durable things at the lower levels. All I'm saying is that the sooner we accept our Google-Boeing-Haoyuan Heavy Industry megacorporate conglomerate overlords, the sooner we can all get beyond our dashed expectations and start working towards the future.
But but but, Google said they Love us!

Sqarak
10-01-2009, 08:46
If that means the Christians are gone, I'm in.

There is no religion, ONLY LIBERTY!
There is also no atheism, because atheism does not belief. A lack of belief is a lack of faith in LIBERTY. No faith in LIBERTY is only punishable by DEATH.

dinkfall
10-01-2009, 09:39
Nah. Societal structures are surprisingly durable things at the lower levels. All I'm saying is that the sooner we accept our Google-Boeing-Haoyuan Heavy Industry megacorporate conglomerate overlords, the sooner we can all get beyond our dashed expectations and start working towards the future.

Amen.



But but but, Google said they Love us!

Google loves us, and we love google, don't we? Or maybe you'd like to move into this village: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMChO0qNbkY

dinkfall
10-01-2009, 09:44
"Several media agencies have identified inconsistencies with the company. For instance their website states they have "years of experience," but a company spokesman said the corporation was formed this February. They also list an address to a building in Washington D.C., but no one at that address has ever heard of them. "

http://www.kulr8.com/news/local/59284497.html

"HARDIN, Mont.—After arriving in this rural city with three Mercedes SUVs marked with the logo of a nonexistent police department, representatives of an obscure California security company said preparations were under way to take over Hardin's never-used, $27 million jail. "
http://www.mercurynews.com/california/ci_13427622?nclick_check=1

And statists dared claim that private police would never work!

Teth
10-01-2009, 10:40
And statists dared claim that private police would never work!
Angry Disenfranchised People: "The state can't do anything right! PRIVATE INDUSTRY UP IN THIS BITCH"
The State: "Sure, fine, whatever, we'll start outsourcing shit. Enjoy your new police force."
Angry Disenfranchised People: "OMG NO ACCOUNTABILITY FUCK THIS PRIVATE POLICE FOOOOORCE"

Oh yes, sir. Oh yes.

palo god
10-01-2009, 11:09
The police forces of the united states should stay government institutions just like our military.

dinkfall
10-01-2009, 11:23
The police forces of the united states should stay government institutions just like our military.

What about my right to defend myself from the evil government? I want a private army capable of taking on the US Armed Forces or I just won't feel like I have any rights at all.

Bissen
10-01-2009, 11:38
What about my right to defend myself from the evil government? I want a private army capable of taking on the US Armed Forces or I just won't feel like I have any rights at all.

Who the fuck is holding you back dickface?

dinkfall
10-01-2009, 11:43
Who the fuck is holding you back dickface?

The statist mob claiming that policing should be left up to the government, I want to police my own neighbourhood.

Villageninja
10-01-2009, 12:12
The statist mob claiming that policing should be left up to the government, I want to police my own neighbourhood.

'EY.... GET MAH GUN OUT'DA TRUCK ED.... Dem crimynals'is back 'gain.


Shoot that sumbitch Paul!


Sorry that was silly of me. See, the problem of your argument is that police are trained to deal with criminals and uphold the law, kay? You? You have a life and a completely different line of work. That's fine and dandy. I don't want you policing the streets because you THINK you can do a better job. You are not trained to deal with criminals. It would not only place your life at risk but likely others as well.

Sqarak
10-01-2009, 12:13
The statist mob claiming that policing should be left up to the government, I want to police my own neighbourhood.

Tanks, gunships, APC'S also cost a lot of money it purchase and maintenance if you want an equally well equipped force to match a government sponsored army.

Bissen
10-01-2009, 12:51
The statist mob claiming that policing should be left up to the government, I want to police my own neighbourhood.

Go out there with your noobskillz and start making citizens arrests all over the place...

Sqarak
10-01-2009, 12:56
Super Dinkfall Out To Strike! Super Dinkfall! Protector Mankind! (http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/49/l_6a3f573329e60b0dacc024ef7fc9e6bf.jpg)

Villageninja
10-01-2009, 13:04
Super Dinkfall Out To Strike! Super Dinkfall! Protector Mankind! (http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/49/l_6a3f573329e60b0dacc024ef7fc9e6bf.jpg)

That picture would kill the boner of the most sexually frustrated pedophile in the world.

StainlessSteelRat
10-01-2009, 13:49
Angry Disenfranchised People: "The state can't do anything right! PRIVATE INDUSTRY UP IN THIS BITCH"
The State: "Sure, fine, whatever, we'll start outsourcing shit. Enjoy your new police force."
Angry Disenfranchised People: "OMG NO ACCOUNTABILITY FUCK THIS PRIVATE POLICE FOOOOORCE"

Oh yes, sir. Oh yes.

Once again, you hit the nail right on the...............oh shit, wait; you missed it.

Sqarak
10-01-2009, 13:54
Angry Disenfranchised People: "The Government enforcing our security is TYRANNY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Private citizen run militias is far beter!!!!"
The State: "Sure, fine, whatever, we'll start outsourcing shit. Enjoy your new police force."
Angry Disenfranchised People: "OMG NO ACCOUNTABILITY FUCK THIS PRIVATE POLICE FOOOOORCE"

Oh yes, sir. Oh yes.

Fixed it for ya.

88Chaz88
10-01-2009, 14:23
This about Hannah Montana's security guards?

Those screaming teens can get rather rowdy.

Badem
10-01-2009, 14:29
I hate all this terrorist business. gone are the days when you could look at an unattended bag on the train an think, "i'll bloody av that"

88Chaz88
10-01-2009, 14:31
I hate all this terrorist business. gone are the days when you could look at an unattended bag on the train an think, "i'll bloody av that"

Shamelessly stolen.

Badem
10-01-2009, 14:35
Shamelessly stolen.

Prove it :ninja:

88Chaz88
10-01-2009, 14:40
Prove it :ninja:

Meh, Mock the Week series 7.

Badem
10-01-2009, 14:41
Meh, Mock the Week series 7.

wild guess but your wrong

88Chaz88
10-01-2009, 14:42
wild guess but your wrong

Andy Parsons has probably used it before then aswell.

Badem
10-01-2009, 15:15
Andy Parsons has probably used it before then aswell.

Andy Parsons ahs probably wiped his arse as well

88Chaz88
10-01-2009, 15:17
Andy Parsons ahs probably wiped his arse as well

It's definitely an Andy Parsons though.

Badem
10-01-2009, 15:34
It's definitely an Andy Parsons though.

Possibly, I stole it from Facebook so no idea

Vessol
10-01-2009, 15:51
Some updates.

American Police Group has the same coat of arms
http://www.americanpolicegroup.com/

as the Serbian Royal Family
http://www.royalfamily.org/index_eng.html

Also it seems as if American Police Force is connected to Blackwater/Xe

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/09/american_police_force_hardin_montana.php ?ref=fpb

"Late Update: Yet another strange development: This page on APF's Web site brags about "our extensive tactical firearms training facility, the U.S. Training Center." But the U.S. Training Center is part of Xe, nee Blackwater. And Xe spokeswoman Stacy DeLuke told us there is no affiliation between Xe and APF."

http://www.ustraining.com/new/index.asp
Copyright © 2009 U.S. Training Center - All Rights Reserved webmaster@ustraining.com. An Xe company.

However, APF has removed all text about the U.S Training Centre, however you can still check the site's cache.
http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:pufYvvcLj3AJ:www.american policegroup.com/special.html%2B%22extensive%2Btactical%2 Bfirearms%2Btraining%2Bfacility,%2Bthe%2 Bu.s.%2Btraining%2Bcenter%22&cd=5&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

So it's pretty obvious that American Police Force is a front company for Blackwater/Xe

Bissen
10-01-2009, 15:59
So it's pretty obvious that American Police Force is a front company for Blackwater/Xe, which is a front for Halliburton and similar companies, which is a front for the real powerplayers controlling the US government

There ya go.

Vessol
10-01-2009, 16:06
There ya go.

Thanks for completing that.

Also, the leader of APF, Michael Hilton(merely the latest incarnation of a man previously known as Miodrag Dokovich, Michael Hamilton, Hristian Djokich and Michael Djokovich), is a long-time criminal.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ifOx0LPKy5B_0KAyPHyNTEqdQz6QD9B269 SG0

Now, it seems from reports, that negotiations got out of hand. Whether part of a secret agreement or just talked about excitedly during negotiations, Captain Michael Hilton has had ambitious plans for town. He has claimed an intent or desire to build a dog shelter, homeless shelter, provide health care to town residents for free, and even have his police officers drive meals to hungry residents! That would be crazy enough for any local police force anywhere, but here’s the topper: Did you notice I said his police force? That’s right, he has plans to patrol the streets. What?!?!? That’s right, a naturalized citizen from the former Yugoslavia, with a ton of alias’ and over a million dollars in unresolved court judgements mostly due to fraud and theft, is to be given complete police powers in an American city, with possible foreign paramilitary soldiers as police.

jonyak
10-01-2009, 16:25
the US is going to outsource itself out of existance...

Ultimo
10-01-2009, 16:27
the US is going to outsource itself out of existance...

Not really, when it gets to the point that we have blown up our economy past repair, it will be cheaper to not outsource things. It all repairs itself eventually!

jonyak
10-01-2009, 16:35
Not really, when it gets to the point that we have blown up our economy past repair, it will be cheaper to not outsource things. It all repairs itself eventually!

but by that point you won't have enough skilled people to actualy do anything for yourselves.

short sighted capitalism FTL...

Bissen
10-01-2009, 16:36
Not really, when it gets to the point that we have blown up our economy past repair, it will be cheaper to not outsource things. It all repairs itself eventually!

Don't you worry mate. They have a brand new bag of global currency to take care of that small problem.

Ultimo
10-01-2009, 16:41
but by that point you won't have enough skilled people to actualy do anything for yourselves.

short sighted capitalism FTL...


Regardless of how our economy goes, our universities are always going to be very good. In fact, taking the example of my field, you can't get more skilled labor anywhere else in the world.

Sure, it is cheaper to outsource my line of work to India. In fact, my company has exported some work, and we pay then around 15k a year salary, which is 1/4 of what our average in house dev makes.

However, as with all things in life, you get what you pay for. Often times (more times than not), the outsourced dev's work is pitiful. It isn't commented, it is inefficient, and it is very buggy. It takes an in house developer like myself more time to repair it than it would have taken me to write it correctly the first time.

So honestly, I don't know why companies outsource. It costs a lot more money in the long run (in a lot of lines of skilled labor work).

Teth
10-01-2009, 18:26
Fixed it for ya.
If a private citizen can start a militia, and if private citizens run militias...who's to say private citizens can't start offering the services of their militia up on the market? Why can't they start professionalizing their militia?

Vessol
10-01-2009, 20:04
If a private citizen can start a militia, and if private citizens run militias...who's to say private citizens can't start offering the services of their militia up on the market? Why can't they start professionalizing their militia?

A militia as is definition of the 2nd Amendment falls under jurisdiction of the local state government, as they are the only ones who can maintain a militia. This has little to do with PMCs however.

I'd be supportive of any private entrepreneurial company at least minimally. However I do not support a company that is funded by government subsidization.

xpiher
10-02-2009, 05:22
You fail to mention unofficial martial law being declared on New Orleans, guns being confiscated and people being put into a bus station turned into a prison for refusing to evacuate.

That wasn't done directly by Blackwater, it was done by the govern of New Orleans trying to satify and protect the biz and rich people's intrest. They are re-building the entire city and state to change it to meet the desiers of those same people. In other words, Katrina was a good excsue to clear out the trash to allow development for cheap. [/quote]


You should read the article though.

Also Republican=Democrat. There is no difference now between either party.

K


If a private citizen can start a militia, and if private citizens run militias...who's to say private citizens can't start offering the services of their militia up on the market? Why can't they start professionalizing their militia?

You don't know much about Blackwater/eX do you?

They aren't meracnaries anymore, they are peacekeepers :lamo:

If the far right/religious left get power again kiss your liberities good bye.

Teth
10-02-2009, 06:42
You don't know much about Blackwater/eX do you?

They aren't meracnaries anymore, they are peacekeepers :lamo:

If the far right/religious left get power again kiss your liberities good bye.
I happen to personally go with the doctrine that the state and its various subdivisions should have a monopoly on force, otherwise you end up with medieval-grade factionalism bullshit.

Under that principle I really do not like all this use of mercenaries, no matter what euphemisms they wrap themselves in.

That said! It's pretty fun watching all the diehard libertarian sorts whine about state interventionism on one hand and then turn around and begin bitching when the state decides to start outsourcing some of its assumed responsibilities to private parties under the theory of "well, the private sector can do it cheaper and more efficiently than us".

CONGRATULATIONS, THE GOVERNMENT IS AGREEING WITH YOU!

Why so sad, then? Is it because what you wanted was, in reality, nothing more than a vain and ephemeral dream?

xpiher
10-02-2009, 06:52
I happen to personally go with the doctrine that the state and its various subdivisions should have a monopoly on force, otherwise you end up with medieval-grade factionalism bullshit.

Under that principle I really do not like all this use of mercenaries, no matter what euphemisms they wrap themselves in.

That said! It's pretty fun watching all the diehard libertarian sorts whine about state interventionism on one hand and then turn around and begin bitching when the state decides to start outsourcing some of its assumed responsibilities to private parties under the theory of "well, the private sector can do it cheaper and more efficiently than us".

CONGRATULATIONS, THE GOVERNMENT IS AGREEING WITH YOU!

Why so sad, then? Is it because what you wanted was, in reality, nothing more than a vain and ephemeral dream?

I lamo was suppose to be :lmao: lol But yes, I completely agree with you. They are now trying to market themselves as peacekeeps like the UN to get contracts to be deployed in areas like Darfur.

Its funny, while I was reading neocon doctrine about privatizing the military to an extent I actually somewhat agreed with it. I mean, why should the US government be paying for troops to protect private business who wish to make profit off the war. Too bad that wasn't their intention since the government is flipping the bill to pay for these security forces/mercenaries anyways.

Villageninja
10-02-2009, 06:59
That wasn't done directly by Blackwater, it was done by the govern of New Orleans trying to satify and protect the biz and rich people's intrest. They are re-building the entire city and state to change it to meet the desiers of those same people. In other words, Katrina was a good excsue to clear out the trash to allow development for cheap.

You sure talk big for someone who doesn't even live in this city or state.

To the both of you, the bus and train stations were used as temporary jails because the regular jails were FLOODED. People were being arrested for incessant looting of drugs, stealing cars, boats and many many other things (They were not arrested for stealing food).

As far as Blackwater goes, you don't know what went on down here. It was like a mini war zone. All the gangs and other criminals decided it was playtime all at once. They took over buildings, raided houses and businesses, mugged survivors who were trying to find a place to go. There was literally a gun battle every single day and every single night for about 3 days straight. It's surreal, walking into a war going on in the very city and suburbs that not a week before was peaceful and happy as could be. I don't condone Blackwater and mercenaries being used in civilian matters often, but this was not one of those times. I was happy to have help and backup, and plenty of it.

You can't speak like you know what it's like in a situation like that where you're being randomly shot at by people for reasons you will never know... unless of course you served in Iraq during the actual war. I imagine it's probably a lot like that. Not knowing whether someone's hiding around the corner of a building waiting to shoot you.

Vessol
10-02-2009, 07:21
Blackwater Claims APF Illegally Using Logos

O_o

Bissen
10-02-2009, 07:39
Blackwater Claims APF Illegally Using Logos

O_o

What I seriously don't get is WHY THE FUCK THEY WOULD STEAL THE SERBIAN ROYAL CREST?

Are they really that lame?

Villageninja
10-02-2009, 08:02
What I seriously don't get is WHY THE FUCK THEY WOULD STEAL THE SERBIAN ROYAL CREST?

Are they really that lame?

Heh, perhaps their "parent company" is really the serbian royal family?! At this point anything seems plausible. It's exciting to follow really, to me anyway. Just curious to see what the outcome will be.

My theory is that these guys are pulling off the biggest con ever witnessed by the public eye and harnessing the general distrust with blackwater to divert some eyes away from them. Who knows.

Sqarak
10-02-2009, 10:34
If a private citizen can start a militia, and if private citizens run militias...who's to say private citizens can't start offering the services of their militia up on the market? Why can't they start professionalizing their militia?

You totally missed my point. It's about how one system is being replaced by another one and the ones who first demanded the change will cry afterwards that they don't like the change.

Villageninja
10-02-2009, 10:47
You totally missed my point.

Missing the point is forumfall in a nutshell.

Teth
10-02-2009, 12:40
You totally missed my point. It's about how one system is being replaced by another one and the ones who first demanded the change will cry afterwards that they don't like the change.
Funnily enough, that's precisely my point as well! We are comrades in this matter. :D

Bissen
10-02-2009, 12:41
Funnily enough, that's precisely my point as well! We are comrades in this matter. :D

I smell gay

Bissen
10-02-2009, 12:42
Did I just own myself?

Badem
10-02-2009, 12:44
Did I just own myself?

is it even possible to do that?

Bissen
10-02-2009, 12:46
is it even possible to do that?

Ok. Did I just pwn myself?

Badem
10-02-2009, 12:49
Ok. Did I just pwn myself?

can you bend over and SKULL FUCK YOURSELF!!!!!111one!one11

if so then yes you did

Bissen
10-02-2009, 12:50
can you bend over and SKULL FUCK YOURSELF!!!!!111one!one11

if so then yes you did

Why bend over? I can lie down and do that :sly:

Sqarak
10-02-2009, 12:54
Why bend over? I can lie down and do that :sly:

So you just stuff it in your mouth and suck on it casually or do you stroke it furiously and suck on it like there is no tomorrow?

Badem
10-02-2009, 12:55
So you just stuff it in your mouth and suck on it casually or do you stroke it furiously and suck on it like there is no tomorrow?

must save a fortune in Tissues and socks as well

Bissen
10-02-2009, 13:01
A little bit'a both.

Marrik
10-02-2009, 15:13
im more worried about the former Uganda deathsquad members theyve got providing security on our military bases in Iraq, because unlike these guys, we KNOW that they abuse their authority and commit murders (heres an interview with a returning veteran talking about it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOuR3SC6Zr0&feature=related).


use of mercenaries is really getting out of hand, imo. we need REAL cops and REAL soldiers who at least have SOME shred of accountability.



a citizens militia is one thing, replacing government forces with private mercenaries who answer to nobody but the one paying them are a different matter entirely.

xpiher
10-02-2009, 16:38
You sure talk big for someone who doesn't even live in this city or state.

To the both of you, the bus and train stations were used as temporary jails because the regular jails were FLOODED. People were being arrested for incessant looting of drugs, stealing cars, boats and many many other things (They were not arrested for stealing food).

As far as Blackwater goes, you don't know what went on down here. It was like a mini war zone. All the gangs and other criminals decided it was playtime all at once. They took over buildings, raided houses and businesses, mugged survivors who were trying to find a place to go. There was literally a gun battle every single day and every single night for about 3 days straight. It's surreal, walking into a war going on in the very city and suburbs that not a week before was peaceful and happy as could be. I don't condone Blackwater and mercenaries being used in civilian matters often, but this was not one of those times. I was happy to have help and backup, and plenty of it.

You can't speak like you know what it's like in a situation like that where you're being randomly shot at by people for reasons you will never know... unless of course you served in Iraq during the actual war. I imagine it's probably a lot like that. Not knowing whether someone's hiding around the corner of a building waiting to shoot you.

The thing is both instances are true. Blackwater was hired by the elite to act as private guards and set up a perimeter around the french quater. The "elite" of the city are trying to change the state to best sever their interest. At the same time, gang-warfare and factionalism straight out of Mad Max also happened. Just because there were legitmate security concerns does not excuse the fact the cluster fuck that is coming becuase of it.


im more worried about the former Uganda deathsquad members theyve got providing security on our military bases in Iraq, because unlike these guys, we KNOW that they abuse their authority and commit murders (heres an interview with a returning veteran talking about it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOuR3SC6Zr0&feature=related).

use of mercenaries is really getting out of hand, imo. we need REAL cops and REAL soldiers who at least have SOME shred of accountability.

a citizens militia is one thing, replacing government forces with private mercenaries who answer to nobody but the one paying them are a different matter entirely.

Or what about ex-Junta commandos and memebrs that took part in the Columbia and Salvadorian death squads, back by the CIA of course. Blackwater is so powerful, they could declare war on a country, since they have long and powerful ties to extra-governmental/nation Chirstian organizations (similar to the Vatican) and topple it.

StainlessSteelRat
10-02-2009, 17:35
That said! It's pretty fun watching all the diehard libertarian sorts whine about state interventionism on one hand and then turn around and begin bitching when the state decides to start outsourcing some of its assumed responsibilities to private parties under the theory of "well, the private sector can do it cheaper and more efficiently than us".

Once again, you have no fucking clue. People are bitching about the APF b/c the deal was shady. People are bitching about the APF b/c the guy in charge is a criminal.

Drink more bleach. It's doing wonders for you brain.

Honorius
10-02-2009, 17:37
How much would a private army cost me?

Villageninja
10-02-2009, 17:42
How much would a private army cost me?

That'll be about.... t'ree fitteh.... thousand.

Honorius
10-02-2009, 17:46
That'll be about.... t'ree fitteh.... thousand.

That seems low, I'm actually being serious, how much would a 100 squad cost me?

Villageninja
10-02-2009, 17:47
The thing is both instances are true. Blackwater was hired by the elite to act as private guards and set up a perimeter around the french quater. The "elite" of the city are trying to change the state to best sever their interest. At the same time, gang-warfare and factionalism straight out of Mad Max also happened. Just because there were legitmate security concerns does not excuse the fact the cluster fuck that is coming becuase of it.

First of all, there's absolutely nothing wrong with New Orleans right now except the same bullshit (murders related to drugs, drug deals, and gangs).

Secondly, What are you even talking about clusterfuck? Are you talking about New Orleans? It's certainly not a clusterfuck right now.

Are you talking about Blackwater? What does their clusterfuck have to do with New Orleans? Are you saying it started there and they were corrupted by it? Little clarification please.

Villageninja
10-02-2009, 17:49
That seems low, I'm actually being serious, how much would a 100 squad cost me?

Seriously. That all depends on what you're going to give your people gearwise, what kind of people you're getting, and what your people are going to be doing.

It could range anywhere from 500k-2 million+

Honorius
10-02-2009, 17:51
Seriously. That all depends on what you're going to give your people gearwise, what kind of people you're getting, and what your people are going to be doing.

It could range anywhere from 500k-2 million+

That's actually not too bad. If my parents die before any crazy shit goes down, I could have a small army.

Villageninja
10-02-2009, 17:58
That's actually not too bad. If my parents die before any crazy shit goes down, I could have a small army.

You'd also probably have to factor in housing, food, and all that other stuff too if you're talking revolutionary type stuff, so add in another 500k-1 mil

xpiher
10-03-2009, 01:23
How much would a private army cost me?

If you live in the south and have friends it can be free, but not very professional. Generally speaking, PMC/mercenaries are paid between $400-$1600 a day for their services, depending on the tier (special forces to gunts) and where they hail from. Blackwater conned Salvadorian mercs out of money by changing their contracts at the last min to $34 a day :lmao:


First of all, there's absolutely nothing wrong with New Orleans right now except the same bullshit (murders related to drugs, drug deals, and gangs).

Secondly, What are you even talking about clusterfuck? Are you talking about New Orleans? It's certainly not a clusterfuck right now.

Are you talking about Blackwater? What does their clusterfuck have to do with New Orleans? Are you saying it started there and they were corrupted by it? Little clarification please.

Sorry I wasn't clear. I was tired.

What I'm saying is, by allowing Blackwater to deploy on American soil to circumvent the laws against using military personnel for police actions sets a dangerous precedent. This precedent could be used to allow similar action in the future to impose martial law without authority from states or congress. Its a legal and moral gray area that should never have been allowed to happen. Furthermore, Blackwater is using their experience in New Orleans (embellished of courese) to justify the governments' need for their services.

The rest of the post was about how Katrina is being used to promote the elites interest in New Orleans's

Teth
10-03-2009, 02:58
Once again, you have no fucking clue. People are bitching about the APF b/c the deal was shady. People are bitching about the APF b/c the guy in charge is a criminal.

Drink more bleach. It's doing wonders for you brain.
Welcome to capitalism as we know it, guv. Where the only crimes are not turning a large enough profit and getting caught committing other crimes.

Vessol
10-03-2009, 02:59
Welcome to capitalism as we know it, guv. Where the only crimes are not turning a large enough profit and getting caught committing other crimes.

lol strawmans

Teth
10-03-2009, 03:02
lol strawmans
Hey, you know it's true. From its very earliest stages of evolution we've been dealing with rapacious robber barons.

What are your feelings on law, anyway? If you adhere to the principle that the law acts as a method to terrify people into compliance with social mores (which, otherwise, they would not adhere to and then we'd all be dancing in anarchy), then you should hardly be surprised by these kinds of developments. Lack of oversight + lack of regulation = "FUCK YEAH WE CAN DO ANYTHIIIIIING".

Vessol
10-03-2009, 04:12
robber barons were enabled because of the U.S government.

Privatizing gains and socializing loses is NOT capitalism. That's Corporate Socialism.

StainlessSteelRat
10-03-2009, 04:20
Hey, you know it's true. From its very earliest stages of evolution we've been dealing with rapacious robber barons.

What are your feelings on law, anyway? If you adhere to the principle that the law acts as a method to terrify people into compliance with social mores (which, otherwise, they would not adhere to and then we'd all be dancing in anarchy), then you should hardly be surprised by these kinds of developments. Lack of oversight + lack of regulation = "FUCK YEAH WE CAN DO ANYTHIIIIIING".

You are such a tool. We, the people, are the oversight. We, the people, stopped whatever the APF had planned. It was government, the entity you want to put in charge of overseeing and regulating that were trying to 'hire' this guy.

xpiher
10-03-2009, 04:51
You are such a tool. We, the people, are the oversight. We, the people, stopped whatever the APF had planned. It was government, the entity you want to put in charge of overseeing and regulating that were trying to 'hire' this guy.

Assuming this isn't a giant scam.

Teth
10-03-2009, 05:31
You are such a tool. We, the people, are the oversight. We, the people, stopped whatever the APF had planned. It was government, the entity you want to put in charge of overseeing and regulating that were trying to 'hire' this guy.
And who is the government before they are the government? Where does the government come from?

We the people, guv.

So ask yourself why your nation is breeding such a degenerate and treacherous government.

Attau
10-03-2009, 06:34
And who is the government before they are the government? Where does the government come from?

We the people, guv.

So ask yourself why your nation is breeding such a degenerate and treacherous government.

Canada would have a more corrupt government.... except that your country is fucking worthless so why bother taking it over. Ouch.

Just kidding - your gov doesn't give a shit about you either and is going along with the SPP crap. You'll have to deal with the American immigrants if it all goes sour here. Lulz @ you guys.

xpiher
10-03-2009, 06:42
Just kidding - your gov doesn't give a shit about you either and is going along with the SPP crap. You'll have to deal with the American immigrants if it all goes sour here. Lulz @ you guys.

Sad but true,

Vessol
10-03-2009, 07:51
Attorney General of Montana is now investigating APF and is telling them to turn over all documents.

Teth
10-03-2009, 09:25
Attorney General of Montana is now investigating APF and is telling them to turn over all documents.
Elements of the judiciary are proving surprisingly competent up here in Canuckistan of late too!

StainlessSteelRat
10-03-2009, 13:45
And who is the government before they are the government? Where does the government come from?

We the people, guv.

So ask yourself why your nation is breeding such a degenerate and treacherous government.

Pitiful rebuttal, you don't address the point. As to why gov't is corrupt, power corrupts. That's nothing new and it occurs all over the world.

Teth
10-03-2009, 14:01
Pitiful rebuttal, you don't address the point. As to why gov't is corrupt, power corrupts. That's nothing new and it occurs all over the world.
What point? That the people whined incessantly about the state's choices, then whined when the state went along with their whining because they didn't like the results, so now money and effort will go down the drain to mop the entire mess up?

It's America's deep-rooted distrust for any sort of formal authority figures or structures that has enabled this distressing rise of PMCs and the like. Congratulations, you've solved one tiny sliver of the problem you made. Now go fucking fix the rest of it already.

StainlessSteelRat
10-03-2009, 14:21
What point? That the people whined incessantly about the state's choices, then whined when the state went along with their whining because they didn't like the results, so now money and effort will go down the drain to mop the entire mess up?

It's America's deep-rooted distrust for any sort of formal authority figures or structures that has enabled this distressing rise of PMCs and the like. Congratulations, you've solved one tiny sliver of the problem you made. Now go fucking fix the rest of it already.

The point that you think more regulation and oversight is needed, i.e. more power, in the hands of
So ask yourself why your nation is breeding such a degenerate and treacherous government.

We have no deep-rooted distrust of authority, we are skeptics and rightfully so. That is why we are the oversight, that is why our Constitution was written and powers delineated as it was.

The rise of PMCs is due to gov't intervention and regulation and people like you who think they should have this power; it's not a result of skepticism or distrust.

You really have no grasp of the notion of cause and effect.

Paralda
10-04-2009, 06:55
This isn't Blackwater, or Xe as it is now called.

There are a bunch of these PMCs

http://www.americanpolicegroup.com/

Is the one in Hardin.

“Government contract databases show no record of the company. Security industry representatives and federal officials said they had never heard of it. On its Web site, the company lists as its headquarters a building in Washington near the White House that holds “virtual offices.” A spokeswoman for the building said American Police Force never completed its application to use the address,” reports AP.

Furthermore, APF was tasked with filling the empty Hardin detention center with inmates, without any clear indication of where those prisoners would come from.

“It’s unclear where the company will get the inmates for the jail. Montana says it’s not sending inmates to the jail, and neither are federal officials in the state,” according to the report.

So, what you're saying is there's a government sponsored private paramilitary organization that the government has no records of/has never heard of? Right.

Vessol
10-04-2009, 09:13
So, what you're saying is there's a government sponsored private paramilitary organization that the government has no records of/has never heard of? Right.

That's the gist of it. I'm from Montana and know a lot of people around the state. No one can dig up any information on them. That's why the Attorney General is investigating them.

Sorry if they are not called the Obama Change Corp, I know you're greatly disappointed.

Villageninja
10-04-2009, 09:37
That's the gist of it. I'm from Montana and know a lot of people around the state. No one can dig up any information on them. That's why the Attorney General is investigating them.

Sorry if they are not called the Obama Change Corp, I know you're greatly disappointed.

You notice they changed the color on their logo to blue?

Paralda
10-04-2009, 18:31
That's the gist of it. I'm from Montana and know a lot of people around the state. No one can dig up any information on them. That's why the Attorney General is investigating them.

Sorry if they are not called the Obama Change Corp, I know you're greatly disappointed.

My point was they probably aren't government affiliated, then.

Bissen
10-04-2009, 19:44
You notice they changed the color on their logo to blue?

Can it get anymore douchy than that?

Villageninja
10-04-2009, 21:05
Can it get anymore douchy than that?

I think it probably could. It sounds like these guys are complete con-artists in every sense of the word.

Vessol
10-05-2009, 00:02
My point was they probably aren't government affiliated, then.

Well apparantly APF's parent company is DynCorp which works very close to the U.S Government.

Plus I have no idea where Two Rivers Authority could have the money for both the prison and to pay APF.

Exultus
10-05-2009, 00:14
God I hope that this prison is for rounding up Libertarians in.

Vessol
10-05-2009, 00:21
God I hope that this prison is for rounding up Libertarians in.

all libertarians need to be gassed and executed

Sqarak
10-05-2009, 09:47
all libertarians need to be gassed and executed

Don't be to liberal with it though, gas is expensive nowadays.

Bissen
10-05-2009, 09:50
Don't be to liberal with it though, gas is expensive nowadays.

Not carbondioxide.

Sqarak
10-05-2009, 10:15
Not carbondioxide.

Common, where are not going to waste our precious softdrink gas on libertarians!

StainlessSteelRat
10-05-2009, 19:34
Plus I have no idea where Two Rivers Authority could have the money for both the prison and to pay APF.

The deal was a lease. APF pays 2 Rivers for the prison.

Drool111
10-06-2009, 00:12
quick, everyone into the cellar. Then I can lock you in there and live a life without stupid conspiracy theories.