Thousands of empty mob camps

[Dragoon]

There are still hundreds of empty camps that should have NPC AI there, hundreds of empty castles and other structures, the center of the world is mostly empty.

Right now we're playing an incomplete game. It would be nice if substantially more mobs are added after every patch. No one wants the world packed with mobs every 10 feet but there are clear locations in the world that should mobs and don't.

[Milo Hobgoblin]

They could double the number of mobs and it would still feel empty in many places.


They dont need to be every 5 feet.. like AC1.. but a ncie compromise between the two.

[zmyth770]

You'd Prefere An extra 200 Mobs and an Extra 200 Issues?
Is it not better to fix existing issues then Add mobs?

Think logically sir.

Time is all you need.

[Dragoon]

You'd Prefere An extra 200 Mobs and an Extra 200 Issues?
Is it not better to fix existing issues then Add mobs?

Think logically sir.

Time is all you need.

I think you're the one who needs to think logically. You do realize that this is a released game that we're paying to play?

This is a PvP game and I'm still having a ton of fun with it but if they don't implement more mobs soon people will start to grow bored once they leave the starting areas. If there are more PvE challenges spread out across the world this would help encourage more exploration/pvE and PvP since the world would have more hotspots.

The recent harvesting changes was a good first step.

[Poacher]

Do you also realise that most mob spawns are idle when areas are empty? If you stay in the area for a while mobs will spawn.

There are indeed a lot of totally deserted ruins etc, but I like it that way, things to explore and admire.

Let's not go the way of the average MMO with "Every structure or remotely interesting landmark must be crawling with mobs."

[Laseen]

Do you also realise that most mob spawns are idle when areas are empty? If you stay in the area for a while mobs will spawn.

There are indeed a lot of totally deserted ruins etc, but I like it that way, things to explore and admire.

Let's not go the way of the average MMO with "Every structure or remotely interesting landmark must be crawling with mobs."

Here, here!

[xpiher]

Mobs can be over farmed. If you approach a mob camp and nothing spawns after a bit, it has been over farmed and they have moved somewhere else. Where they moved to I don't know, but after about 10mins or so they return.

[In Nox]

I'd like to see a greater variety of solo-able mobs. :/

Fill these empty spots up with something a lone player can take on!

[Hurtis]

Those empty spots are populated however you must stay in that area for a while for them to trigger....

[Gammabeam]

The above is right. ^^^^^^

Trigger times for a mobspawn is around a minute. With lagged Server significantly longer. Trigger zones are VERY small usually, and if you leave the trigger zone mobs despawn after like a minute again.

So what's wrong imho is the radius of the trigger zone , and the time for mob appearing finally.

Most POI look empty if you just ride or run through. So mobs really only spawn if server is sure you stay in that area.

I had a small round isle, surrounded with a ring of water. As you stepped on the isle mobs spawned after like a minute. If you left isle and swam in the small water ring, mobs despawned.....

That's really a bit 'overoptimized' imho. Greedy AV should spend a couple more PC's for that in their server array...

[Homeless Jimmy]

mobs only spawn once you Stay in an area? so theres no pve challenge at all to traversing the map? lol

[Ruyn]

Maybe the dynamic mob spawn has been turned on. Maybe the mobs are propagating and will unleash their evilness unto the world at an opportune time? Maybe not.

[Dovregubben]

Mobs spawn once you get close to such an area usually, but the mob server seems to have had some problems lately. Sometimes the spawns wouldn't be activated, even if you were close for a longer period of time. I tried both before and after the maintenance today, got no spawns to spawn before, and lots of spawns now after.

[sefer]

so, mobs spawn when you get into their area? Sounds fun too me, reminds me of .hack//sign, where a portal opens when the guy gets near, and the monster comes out of it.

[tejón]

mobs only spawn once you Stay in an area? so theres no pve challenge at all to traversing the map? lol
There are some mobs which are always spawned. A friend and I once got ambushed by a hill giant while riding... no joke, it was hiding behind a tree and started throwing rocks as soon as we passed by.

It wasn't like this in beta, by the way. You could approach an area with no other players around, and there would be mobs visible from outside of spell range. It's clearly a performance optimization, and once they have the server fully populated AND queues fully controlled, I expect the mobs to be a bit less shy.

[JCatano]

DF uses a Dynamic Spawn System. The definition of a DSS in a programming sense is that the server will spawn the appropriate number of mobs when a player, or players, enter a predetermined radius of the "camp". Traditional spawn systems stricly use a timer. A DSS uses traffic and a timer.

According to their old FAQ, a camp can be overfarmed and the spawns will pop-up in another spot. This may be one reason why mobs disappear for long periods of time near starter areas. I've seen a number of goblins and skeletons far out into the wilderness when people are complaining about newbie area mobs not spawning.

Anyway... If you do not kill off all of the mobs, they will stay there until someone finishes them off. Once cleaned out, the mobs will reappear if you stick around, but keep the FAQ in mind. If everyone leaves the radius before the mobs respawn, then they will not show up until someone else passes within the radius. This helps to save server resources.

In saying all of that, I don't know exactly how DF has coded their system, but the above is what I have observed. Sometimes you can tell if your presence spawned the mobs or if they were already there. If you did it, they will spawn fairly late at times, which is kind of annoying. If someone else spawned them, you'll be able to see them much further away.

And... It's also obvious that the DSS is a bit broken, too. Hopefully, they can work on it soon.

P.S. - There are also static boss-type mobs, so it's not a 100% DSS.

[leone2nd]

There are still hundreds of empty camps that should have NPC AI there, hundreds of empty castles and other structures, the center of the world is mostly empty.

Right now we're playing an incomplete game. It would be nice if substantially more mobs are added after every patch. No one wants the world packed with mobs every 10 feet but there are clear locations in the world that should mobs and don't.

Mobs were there in reality but..
...I killed them all so hard they decided they had enough of it and migrated altogether in another game.

Sorry..:(

[Zuku]

DF uses a Dynamic Spawn System. The definition of a DSS in a programming sense is that the server will spawn the appropriate number of mobs when a player, or players, enter a predetermined radius of the "camp". Traditional spawn systems stricly use a timer. A DSS uses traffic and a timer.

According to their old FAQ, a camp can be overfarmed and the spawns will pop-up in another spot. This may be one reason why mobs disappear for long periods of time near starter areas. I've seen a number of goblins and skeletons far out into the wilderness when people are complaining about newbie area mobs not spawning.

Anyway... If you do not kill off all of the mobs, they will stay there until someone finishes them off. Once cleaned out, the mobs will reappear if you stick around, but keep the FAQ in mind. If everyone leaves the radius before the mobs respawn, then they will not show up until someone else passes within the radius. This helps to save server resources.

In saying all of that, I don't know exactly how DF has coded their system, but the above is what I have observed. Sometimes you can tell if your presence spawned the mobs or if they were already there. If you did it, they will spawn fairly late at times, which is kind of annoying. If someone else spawned them, you'll be able to see them much further away.

And... It's also obvious that the DSS is a bit broken, too. Hopefully, they can work on it soon.

P.S. - There are also static boss-type mobs, so it's not a 100% DSS.

One of the features the devs touted early on was of the intelligence of the mobs. Okay, so not too much there.

Another feature was that mobs, if not killed off, would begin to build little camps > villages. Anyone gonna hold their breath?

I agree with someone else's point that this so-called DSS makes for boring travel.

[pprllo]

DF uses a Dynamic Spawn System. The definition of a DSS in a programming sense is that the server will spawn the appropriate number of mobs when a player, or players, enter a predetermined radius of the "camp". Traditional spawn systems stricly use a timer. A DSS uses traffic and a timer.

DSS = Just another way to say "ZOMG I need to save execution time on AI and Collision Detection routines !!!". :D
Whatever, I think the big problem here is that they completely failed to tweak camp radiuses and timers.

[Dragoon]

DF uses a Dynamic Spawn System.

Not it does not.

[bongloads]

Dungeons were completely empty of mobs today

[JCatano]

Not it does not.

Yes, it does. That's why mobs will pop up when you're near. (Not render in a graphical sense, but actually pop before your eyes after the machines running that node realize a player is near). They will also disappear right in front of your eyes at times, because the DSS isn't always functioning properly.

[Strontyd]

well the timings and radius are def way off. the radius needs to be much larger so the mobs pop before you are in range, they also need to change the de spawn as well so the mobs dont keep de spawning when you move slightly out of range to stop yourself getting ganked.

The ideal radius would be to pop the mobs just as you come into viewing range, and make it the same for despawning so that mob youve just spent the last ten mins beating down doesnt despawn just cos you move slightly outside the ridiculously small spawn radius.

[Requiamer]

That's why mobs will pop up when you're near. (Not render in a graphical sense, but actually pop before your eyes after the machines running that node realize a player is near). They will also disappear right in front of your eyes at times, because the DSS isn't always functioning properly.

That doesn't make it dynamic at all. What you describe is done by all the emulator i played with, and i'm pretty sure all the mmo around as well. It is done so to reduce the resource needed to process the world. If the server had to calculate every damn movement each mob were doing you just wouldn't be able to have such huge maps with so many mobs and players. Thats why mob appear only if a player is around. But in other mmo & emulated mmo you just don't feel it because well, they trigger the spawn before you can see them ingame.

[tbob418]

Call me crazy, but i like exploring in DF, it feels different.

I came across a ruined lighthouse-ish little area with a single ghost mob in it. There may be more of the same looking locations, but it felt unique.

First thought i had was "Does this ghost have a story?". Who knows, maybe a quest out there for it.... probably not though.

[SeTiDaYeTi]

That doesn't make it dynamic at all. What you describe is done by all the emulator i played with, and i'm pretty sure all the mmo around as well. It is done so to reduce the resource needed to process the world. If the server had to calculate every damn movement each mob were doing you just wouldn't be able to have such huge maps with so many mobs and players. Thats why mob appear only if a player is around. But in other mmo & emulated mmo you just don't feel it because well, they trigger the spawn before you can see them ingame.

Simply AV did (yet another) poor implementation of something every other MMO has and tried to sell it as an uber cool new idea.

Fascinating...

[Signus]

The game is not nearly as empty as it was in beta. Seems they are still adding quests and mob camps to the game as they go along. Last patch put in like, 35 quests and a bunch of new mob spawns. Let's hope they keep going and put back in the epic storyline they talked about.

[wanderingdrunk]

I heard a beta rumor somewhere that for every mob in game there is one less player they can allow on the server or soemthing like that. While definatley a very good reason, I can also imagine that some spawns are simply broken at this point or not implemented properly. Or maybe we simply have not figured out how to activate them. Or maybe they are simply being saved for future use? Tougher/alternate mob camps?

For every empty camp there is about 5 ones with mobs.. There really is no problem finding one to farm without contest.

[Lumanil]

They add mobs with every patch i think, even without telling us with the patch notes.
At release there were lots of locations i didn't see mobs in, but there are now.

Visit http://www.DFatlas.com or http://www.exploiter.org/darkfall/

There are locations of new mobs added daily...

[DwellerBelow]

There are still hundreds of empty camps that should have NPC AI there, hundreds of empty castles and other structures, the center of the world is mostly empty.

Right now we're playing an incomplete game. It would be nice if substantially more mobs are added after every patch. No one wants the world packed with mobs every 10 feet but there are clear locations in the world that should mobs and don't.

The mob camps have been despawned due to bugs and exploitation. My clan mates report that there are whole dungeons that have been completly despawned.

It would be nice to have the full game, but with so much in the way of features missing or not yet implemented, I just don't miss a few super buggy mob spawns.

[DwellerBelow]

Yes, it does. That's why mobs will pop up when you're near. (Not render in a graphical sense, but actually pop before your eyes after the machines running that node realize a player is near). They will also disappear right in front of your eyes at times, because the DSS isn't always functioning properly.

well the timings and radius are def way off. the radius needs to be much larger so the mobs pop before you are in range, they also need to change the de spawn as well so the mobs dont keep de spawning when you move slightly out of range to stop yourself getting ganked.

The ideal radius would be to pop the mobs just as you come into viewing range, and make it the same for despawning so that mob youve just spent the last ten mins beating down doesnt despawn just cos you move slightly outside the ridiculously small spawn radius.

Yes, right, correct, yep, yepper-doo. You got it.

[Thidias]

I like the fact that there aren't mobs all over everything like in WoW and other hand holding MMOs. I loved Morrowind and Daggerfall for getting the mob placement perfect in my opinion, the worlds still felt HUGE and populated, believable, and very fun. They have in fact been adding in and tweaking mobs every patch, and they are working towards a balance. They are getting close, and I think in the next couple of patches they are going to continue to roll out content patches. In fact, I'll quote from the 2 most recent patches mobs and NPC quests/AI that has been added:


More quests have been added:

ALFAR FACTIONS

• THE HARN MANDEAN
• The Abandoned Stronghold
• Unwanted Neighbors
• Assistance from Shoal's Finest
• The Element of Fire
• Ninseri of Espenhal
• A Fair Trade
• More Clues of an Unknown Power
• TEMPLE OF THE GOD KING
• Nobody disobeys Shoal
• Shoal's Iron Fist
• Not Worthy
• A Mission Completed
• THE RADIANT CIRCLE
• The Demon Hand Legend
• The Windlords of Velmuna
• The Demon's Hand
• A Much Desired Artifact
• THE SHADOW SALIENT
• Grey Ork Hideout


HUMAN FACTIONS

• KNIGHTS OF MALREGARD
• A Trip to Sanguine
• Into the Twilight Kingdom
• WHITE ORDER
• Help for Silverley
• Assisting the enchanters of Silverley ***The Shadow of Highmoore
• SONS OF RIADA
• Secrets of the Nithron
• Heralds of Reconquest
• Chronicles of the Firstborn
• A Prophecy Come True

MAHIRIM FACTIONS

• THE WOLFMASKS
• The Cursed of Fang Lake
• A Marked Gravestone
• Honoring the Alliance
• THE CIRCLE OF NEITH
• These Mysterious Guardians
• Elusive Akathars
• Dim Stormrunes for Celetia
• THE LONGCLAW
• Proof of Existence
• A much awaited package
• Problems in Wolf Run
• The Centaurs of Wolf Run
• The Centaur Report
• ELDERS OF RED MOON
• Summoned by Red Moon
• The Lost Hero


New Weapons

• Orkish Strongbow
• Mirdain Seeker
• Mahirim Preyfinder
• Dwarven Warbow
• Alfar Deathsinger
• Mercian Composite Bow

Monsters

• Spellcasting monsters have been re-balanced
• Snow Clan Elder loot has been tweaked

The following skills have been re-ballanced:

• Greatclub Mastery
• Greataxe Mastery
• Greatsword Mastery
• Knife Mastery
• Polearm Mastery
• Sword Mastery
• Axes
• Clubs And Maces
• Greatclubs
• Greatsword Power Attack
• Sword Power Attack

Visual Updates:

• Jungle Vegetation
• Iklit Houses
• Human Houses
• Human NPCs
• Some human castle walls

Area/Worldbuilding updates in the Human area:

• Bloodscar
• Hawkmoore
• Highmore
• Bluefield
• Brockmoore
• Lainstone
• Broadherne
• Greendale
• Cranwyn Bay
• Somerstone
• Wetfang
• Outer Cranwyn Bay
• Bladethorpe
• Quattenhal
• Scarbourne
• Nekaria
• Sandstone
• Taleria
• Hammerdale
• Gulghat

All of the Ice Continent has been updated

[JCatano]

That doesn't make it dynamic at all. What you describe is done by all the emulator i played with, and i'm pretty sure all the mmo around as well. It is done so to reduce the resource needed to process the world. If the server had to calculate every damn movement each mob were doing you just wouldn't be able to have such huge maps with so many mobs and players. Thats why mob appear only if a player is around. But in other mmo & emulated mmo you just don't feel it because well, they trigger the spawn before you can see them ingame.

What I explained, and what you just repeated, is exactly what a dynamic spawn system is. Some games use a static system, some use a dynamic system, others use both.

Dynamic spawn system is simply a coding term.

[Adam1902]

Well, the world is definately not empty. And yeah, they are adding more mobs with patches. There's often times when I go through ruins, and have a look inside to see what spawns, and... nothing. Go there again after a patch, and FUCK! You're running from 5 tough fuckers wanting your head on a stick.

All they need to do is:
- populate the rest of the mob camps (clearly being done)
- fix exploitable mob AI (I can bet they're looking into this)
- Add wild-life. Not so much that theres mobs every few feet, but... Just wildlife. The most "lesser" mobs in the game are Goblins. Why can't there be Cows, Pigs, Deer, Hens etc? (They're probably not planning this, but you never know. I think they should though - and probably will in the future)

The mob camps have been despawned due to bugs and exploitation. My clan mates report that there are whole dungeons that have been completly despawned.

It would be nice to have the full game, but with so much in the way of features missing or not yet implemented, I just don't miss a few super buggy mob spawns.

Yeah, I can bet that very tough monsters that drop considerably nice loot aren't in-game just yet. Obviously because they know the mob AI can be exploited.

[mrbubbles]

I like the fact that there aren't mobs all over everything like in WoW and other hand holding MMOs. I loved Morrowind and Daggerfall for getting the mob placement perfect in my opinion, the worlds still felt HUGE and populated, believable, and very fun. They have in fact been adding in and tweaking mobs every patch, and they are working towards a balance. They are getting close, and I think in the next couple of patches they are going to continue to roll out content patches. In fact, I'll quote from the 2 most recent patches mobs and NPC quests/AI that has been added:

Morrowind was fun, except for the damn cliff racers, those things were fucking everywhere, and they would ambush me three or four at a time.

[Dragoon]

I like the fact that there aren't mobs all over everything like in WoW and other hand holding MMOs.

I really wish that slow people would stop using this infantile excuse. We don't want mobs everywhere like in WOW, we just want the mob camps that are there (there are plenty) to actually have things inside them.

When you noobs leave the starting areas and explore you'll realize how empty the world is.